The Dollar Crisis Goes Digital, GOLD Wins | Peter Schiff
Summary
Peter Schiff warns that investors are mispricing gold, silver and the entire U.S. debt situation. With U.S. debt approaching $40 …
Transcript
What is the US doing about the debt problem? Nothing. In fact, they're not doing nothing. They're actually making it worse, which I guess counts as doing something. They have no understanding of the fiscal uh crisis that's coming and the sovereign debt crisis. It's not subprime borrowers who can't pay. It's the US government that can't pay. Yes, the US government can print. Uh but that creates the bigger problem. And that's why gold is the solution to that problem. A stable coin that's stable to the dollar has no stability because the dollar has no stability. What people don't realize, but they will eventually is that the stable coin industry is going to be dominated by gold. Tokenization of gold is the solution. The S&P 500 is rallying from record high to record high. Yet gold seems to be stuck at $4,500. It is consolidating. And there is so much we need to discuss in that regard. What is happening, of course, in the Middle East, but we need to talk about inflation, the US debt situation. We're nearing $40 trillion already. It could happen even before July 4th, the 250th birthday of the United States. That'd be an absolute insane milestone to achieve. I'm not sure that's an achievement, but a milestone to reach. And we need to discuss what that really means. What are the ramifications here? and how fragile is everything that we're seeing in markets right now. I've invited back Peter Schiff. He's the founder of Europe Pacific Capital Asset Management and of course an avid gold bug. He he knows the space like nobody else. And I'm really curious what his takeaway is. How is he reading the situation right now? Before I switch over to Peter though, hit that like and subscribe button. Helps us out tremendously with the algorithm of course and it helps us bring fantastic guests like Peter onto the program. Thanks so much for doing that. Now Peter, it's a great pleasure to welcome you back here on Soore Financially. Thanks so much for joining us again. >> Oh, thanks Kai. Always my pleasure to uh spend some time with you. >> Yeah, really looking forward to the next 30 minutes, Peter. We have lots to discuss, lots going on, of course. Um we need to maybe start with gold. Um lots happening in the world right now. Uh gold seems to be stuck though at $4,500. Um ignoring everything that that's happening around it. I just touched on a few points here in my intro, but uh how are you reading the gold price right now? I just think we're consolidating after a big breakout, both gold and silver. Uh, you know, gold broke out of 2000, which was really the the the cap. It got up near there in 2011 and then pulled back and then almost or just briefly got above 2,000 in 2020 and then pulled back and then it finally broke out for good in 2024 and we got as high as 5600 or so. Silver didn't break out until the end of last year, early this year, and it it had been stuck around 20, $30, and it went all the way up to 125, but it had a lot of resistance just below 50. And so, both metals have taken out the resistance. First silver, then gold, and now they're consolidating. Um, and I think the next move is another leg up. The only question is what's going to be the catalyst to break gold and silver out of the consolidation phase. Uh it may be a breakdown in the stock market. I mean right now it's risk on and everybody's buying tech stocks. It's also, you know, the war uh and people thinking that that means the Fed's not going to cut rates or they may hike rates and that's been a headwind. But what investors are missing is the tailwind of collapsing real rates. Because while the Fed has been talking about what they might may or may not do or in markets are speculating on what the Fed may or may not do, what we know they're not doing now is they're not hiking rates. But what is happening is inflation is rising. And that means real rates are falling. And that is very bullish for gold and silver. The question is when are traders going to figure this out? I was just going to say the market hasn't really realized that. Gloigree even went so far in our show to say the market is wrong um about that you know pricing it properly right >> the market gets a lot of stuff wrong initially in the long run you know it gets it right but in the short run it often gets it wrong and and that's what creates opportunities for investors if you can see circumstances where the market has it wrong like you know during the subprime bubble uh when it was clear to me and some others that the markets were mispricing subprime mortgages, they were trading for par and I thought they were worth zero. So, the market was wrong initially, but ultimately they got repriced to zero, which is where I thought they they should have been. And and so this is a similar situation in that uh investors are mispricing gold and silver. They're mispricing gold and silver related equities because they don't understand what's going to happen. They didn't understand what was going to happen to the real estate market and the consequence for real estate related debt. Uh and now they have no understanding of the fiscal uh crisis that's coming and the sovereign debt crisis. It's not subprime borrowers who can't pay, it's the US government that can't pay. Yes, the US government can print. Uh but that creates the bigger problem and that's why gold is the solution to that problem. Abs. >> Absolutely. And you just touched on real rates as well collapsing because we have rising inflation. We need to talk about that because typically inflation and rising inflation is good for gold but not in this case. It seems to make gold you know drop every time uh we we get more or higher oil prices meaning high possible higher inflation data. Um why is that correlation that used to be intact now broken? >> Yeah. again because people are thinking about how the Fed will react to the higher inflation numbers and they perceive that as a negative for gold. And one of the reasons that gold had a big rally was the expectation that the Fed would be cutting rates. And now that those expectations have been uh tempered and in fact replaced with the expectation of hikes, but all that is really noise uh because what's really driving gold and silver is is not that the Fed was going to be cutting rates, but that inflation was north of its 2% target and never going to get back. And in fact, uh, you know, we're we're going to be printing, uh, inflation numbers much higher than 2% as far as the eye can see. And that's going to be the driver, uh, for gold. It's going to be the need to escape the loss of purchasing power that you will suffer if you hold US dollars or any debt instruments denominated in dollars because the yield that you earn will not be high enough to compensate you for the purchasing power that you lose. like the the market is is completely ignoring what we just discussed here as as you said like it's completely maybe misunderstanding ignoring um the fact that that gold still is your your protector. It reacts and the gold price story reacts very aggressively even to to headline news to to the noise out there like when can it decouple like like we've seen before like we need that decoupling to happen again. >> Yeah, I don't know. I mean there's going to be a catalyst. something's going to happen to break gold and silver out of their respective consolidations. Um, it'll be obvious in hindsight once it happens, but you know, it'll it'll be it could be anything. I just don't know. I just know it's going to happen. Uh, you know, and so eventually something will will set it off. You know, just like I always thought oil prices were going to go up. I thought bond yields would go up. The catalyst for the recent move was the Iran war. But if it hadn't been that, it would have been something else. And and that's where I think a lot of people are making a mistake, too. They think, well, when the war is over, oil prices are going to come right down. Bond yields are going to come down. I don't think so. There may be a knee-jerk reaction where you get a bit of a move down in oil prices and down in bond yields, but it won't last. And I think the upward trend in both is going to continue long after the war ends. Uh if it ends, you know, who knows at this point. Now, as you said, like gold is trading back like it is a commodity, right? It's not trading like it's a there's a system change upon us or a financial reset like so many have forecast as well. Which brings me to the debt situation in general. Um 40 almost 40 trillion. You you just mentioned it 39.3 I think you you said before we hit the record button. Uh is the US debt situation as well. All of these facts are being ignored by by gold right now. Or is that all priced in? Is it ignored or priced in? That's the question. Look, you you you asked earlier in the interview, what is the US doing about the debt problem? Nothing. In fact, they're not doing nothing. They're actually making it worse, which I guess counts as doing something, but they're not doing something about the problem. They're doing something to make the problem bigger. And in fact, you know, uh, the former secretary of the treasury, Hank Pollson, he recently said that the US needs to develop a break the glass emergency plan to deal with the crisis that is inevitable once foreigners don't want to buy our bonds. And this is coming from a prior Secretary of the Treasury. So, it's not like it's Peter Schiff saying it. somebody who was an insider uh under Bush, you know, sounding the alarm. And the most interesting thing about Paulson's uh saying that we need this plan is what he didn't say. He didn't say, "Hey, there's going to be a crisis one day when foreigners don't want to buy our bonds. So, let's act now to prevent that crisis. Let's get our fiscal house in order so we don't need a break the glass emergency plan. Let's try to preempt the emergency. Let's show the world that we're serious about tackling our debt. Let's cut government spending. You know, let's do something." Now, he didn't even bother to suggest that because he knows it's never going to happen. He has resigned himself to the inevitable. We are never going to take preemptive actions. We're never going to get the debt under control. We're not going to cut spending. We are going to keep the pedal to the metal until this car goes off the edge of a cliff. He just wants us to be able to do something, you know, you know, before it hits the the the the ground, before the, you know, um but I I just don't think there's anything you could do. I don't see an emergency plan working. I think by the time you need to break the glass, it's too late. >> Well Well, they've tried at least Doge was a was a try, but it failed miserably, of course, because politics, right? It just doesn't work. Um, which brings me sort of I wouldn't say the next topic, but it's a good segue to talk about the next or the current new Fed chair. Um, the question though is Peter, is he already trapped? Is he in a no losing position there? >> Yeah. I mean, Kevin Walsh, yeah, I mean, he's he's uh he's between and Iran in a hard place, I guess. Uh, but, you know, there's nothing that he could do. uh you know the markets expect the Fed to be cutting rates even if the next move may be a hike. Uh everybody assumes that's just a war related uh temporary situation. But the marching orders that Trump gave everybody who was under consideration uh was you start cutting rates. That's your job to cut rates. And even though at the confirmation, not the confirmation hearing, at the inauguration, uh Trump said, "Look, you know, Kevin, do your own thing. I trust you. Don't look at me. Just do whatever you want." You know, obviously that's not the case because that wasn't the case uh with with uh Powell and Trump appointed Pal and he beat the crap out of him, you know, for not not cutting rates. So why is Walsh going to get the benefit of the doubt that that he didn't extend uh to Pal? Um so I think that was all for the cameras and for the Forex traders and you know to try to you know under the table I'm sure they got a a handshake deal like hey buddy you know you know what you're there to do. Um, but he's in a bad position because, you know, the markets want this, but he can't deliver it without destroying the dollar um and and the bond market, which would force him to quantitative easing, which is something that he has opposed correctly in the past. But now he's going to be in charge of ramping up the program because if he doesn't do it, then, you know, we have a financial crisis. If he does do it, we have something worse. But Trump obviously is going to be pressuring him. But, you know, there there's no way out. I don't think the Fed can do what it did in 2020 to bail out COVID or in 2008 for the financial crisis. I don't think the next round of QE is going to work the way the last rounds did. I I think that the market is going to reject it. and and so it's going to create a bigger problem than the one they're trying to solve. >> I I want to talk about the dollar because I think it's it's an interesting one because I'm trying to figure out like what what role does it play in general and what does the White House want to achieve because I remember President Trump saying in his first term he does want a weaker dollar. So the question is like what what is weaker? Let's let's use the Dixie for example um where we're right around 100 again. Um what what what is weaker and how much wiggle room is there before the currency fails, Peter? >> Yeah. Well, the problem is, you know, Trump wants his dollar cake and then he wants to eat it too, which you can't have. He wants a weaker dollar, but he wants a stronger dollar at the same time. You know, he wants a weaker dollar because he thinks that helps our our balance of trade. It makes it easier for us to sell products abroad and it makes imports more expensive. So, he thinks it'll help with the trade deficit. But he also knows that we need the dollar as the reserve currency. He knows that that's key uh to our ability to finance our trade deficits and to finance our budget deficits. And our whole standard of living is predicated on the dollar being the reserve currency. Yet, in order for it to maintain its reserve status, it needs to stay strong because the people think the dollar is going to weaken. They're not going to want to hold it. So, they have to have confidence that it's not going to weaken. So, how do you have a weak dollar and a strong dollar at the same time? Right? Obviously, you can't. Um, but you know, I think we're going to get a weak dollar whether the president wants it or not. Uh, and it's going to be a big problem. And I think the dollar is in the process of losing its reserve status. And I don't think there's any way to abort that process. I think it's going to continue. And you know, there's an old saying about how you go broke uh slowly at first and then all at once. And we've been in the slowly part for a while. Uh the all at once part is coming. I get I just don't know when. But I want to be prepared. >> Like with the military action over the last let's say five six months here uh from the US, have they strengthened the position of the dollar the petro dollar uh in the global system? or have they maybe pushed back that that phase out? >> I think we've exposed the weakness because we barely got a bounce out of the dollar because of the war and the dollar is about where it was before the war. Um, and we may lose the war. That's the problem is, you know, we know Iran is not going away. We're not getting regime change. I mean, that was clearly a goal that Trump established and we're not going to get that goal. The only thing we may get, and we may not even get that, is some kind of nuclear deal. Uh, but I think America's status in the Gulf is going to be diminished as a result of the fact that we couldn't get rid of the Iranian government, that they that they withstood all of our bombs and all of our missiles. And in fact, Iran may emerge from this with more influence and power in the region and we have less. uh and they may be in an even better economic position. They may have fewer sanctions or no sanctions. They may have control of the straight of Hermuz. They may be charging tolls. Who the hell knows? Uh but I think all this ultimately diminishes our status. Um and it weakens the dollar even further. >> But it's not accelerating the dilization trend. >> No, I don't know. I mean, I think the trend was already there. um whether it accelerates it or not, you know, it's hard to say it might. Uh it's going to accelerate itself. I mean, it's just going to snowball, right? Because, you know, as it rolls down the hill, it gets bigger and bigger and bigger. Uh and so, you know, we're ultimately our own worst enemy. I think what Biden did and then Trump did more of it by weaponizing the dollar and and sanctioning people that we don't like that that accelerated the process. Um, you know, >> no, absolutely. Kicking, you know, Russia out of the Swift system definitely like kicked off that pro or accelerated the the phase. >> Yeah. Because it not only it not only gave Russia an incentive to get the hell out of the dollar, but it gave everybody else an incentive because they didn't want to be the next Russia. It was like an example of what could happen. And you know, so the rest, you know, Russia was the uh you know, you know, took it for everybody else, right? They they suffered, but it was a wake-up call to everybody else that hey, you know, get rid of your dollars now or this could happen to you. >> Absolutely. No, and that's why I think we've seen central banks buy gold hand over fist and uh coming back. >> Yeah. The only way the US government could take your gold is to actually invade you if you have the gold there. Now, if you store it at the Fed, they could take that. But if you physically bury the gold in the ground in your own vaults, you you know, there's nothing the US government can do. They if you have US treasuries, they got you. They can do whatever the hell they want. They don't have to pay those treasuries. They could they could default. They could selectively default on the ones that you own. They could freeze the dollars that you've got. Uh so you know why would you want to give so much power to the US especially if if the US regards you as an enemy right if you're China and we have all this anti-China rhetoric you know China's our big enemy and yet China's holding on to all these dollars and all these you know dollar denominated bonds why would you want to be in that vulnerable position if you're our enemy why would you want to give us that weapon to use against you >> Peter since you brought China into the mix of the conversation here just just real quick. Uh um are you surprised um disappointed perhaps by the outcome of the the she meeting in in Beijing there? >> Well, I'm not surprised at all that nothing came out of it. I mean, it was all a photo op uh for, you know, for Trump. I mean, they could have just had a Zoom call. I mean, what did they get out of it? >> What was the famous >> This could have been an email. >> Well, yeah. I mean, look, China's going to buy some planes from from Boeing. What else? I mean, of course, they buy planes from Boeing. what else they could do with their dollars. I mean, Boeing makes decent planes. China needs planes, you know, so they're going to buy Boeing planes. You know, the funnier part was the agriculture deal. You know, Trump made a big deal. Oh, we got the Chinese to commit to buying 17 billion of US agriculture over the over the next two years. So, what when Biden was president, they averaged over 30 billion a year. I mean, 17 billion is about half of what they used to buy before his tariffs blew up our export market. uh exports to China of agriculture collapsed in 2025 because of the tariffs. And now Trump succeeds in getting China to agree to buy half of what it was buying before the tariffs. And he's saying this is this great deal that he negotiated. Um you know on behalf of the farmers uh you know thanks thanks for the help. Um so you know it this is a fake a fake victory you know uh that he's that he's uh that he's claiming. So, no, I don't think anything came out of this. >> Uh, I'm curious, Peter, like do do you think the US has actually managed to strengthen its position versus China um over the last say 18 months? >> No, I think we've weakened our position. You know, we backed away from a lot of the tariffs and then others were declared unconstitutional. We still have some tariffs, but look, China's exports are growing. They're not shrinking. Yes, their exports to the US are going down, but they're exporting more to the rest of the world, and that makes the US less important for the Chinese, and that is a problem because we need America to be important to China. So, they'll keep buying our bonds and loaning us money. Uh, but if they realize they don't need our market as much, well, then they don't lend us as much. They don't buy our financial assets. But we're also dependent on China, not just for financing. But the goods that the Chinese manufacture are not goods that we can produce ourselves. I mean maybe in in in the future if we invested enough in building the plants and building out the required uh infrastructure and supply chains and training the workers. But all that is going to take years and years and years and cost a lot of money that we don't have. Um, so I think what's happening is just revealing how dependent the United States is on China uh for manufactured goods and the fact that China doesn't need to sell those goods to Americans who can't afford them. There's an entire world out there that they can sell to. And if they allow the dollar to collapse, which I think they ultimately will and you see a big rise in the Chinese R&B, it's the Chinese consumers that are going to be buying all the stuff that Americans can't afford. And so rather than exporting what they produce, a lot more of what they produce will be consumed domestically uh by their own citizens. And and that's a much better deal for China than just getting our inflation. >> No, absolutely. I think that's what the US wants though as well. wants the China to produce and consume more. Consume >> be careful what you wish for because what the Chinese consume, Americans can't consume, you know. You know, I mean, what's America going to look like when all the shelves at Walmart and and Amazon are empty? You know, you think you think the cost of living is high now. Wait till you see how much more expensive it's going to get when that happens. >> No, absolutely. Uh it's it's an interesting one. You can't live without the other. you know, it's a lovehate relationship, >> right? Um, no, Peter, um, you touched on the bond market earlier and I really want to talk about stable coins as well because I think that's the segue and it's a topic we haven't really discussed yet with you um, on the channel. Uh, because it's being hailed as an absolute financial savior uh, maybe is is it a savior, the dollar savior, or is it more of a trap? Actually, Peter, what do you make of stable coins? A stable coin that's stable to the dollar has no stability because the dollar has no stability. What people don't realize, but they will eventually is that the stable coin industry is going to be dominated by gold. Tokenization of gold is the solution. It solves the problem uh that Bitcoin can't or the stable coins can't. See, Bitcoin was sold as a store of value. Uh, but it's not a store of value because it has no value that you could store. But even the people who buy Bitcoin concede it's not a good medium of exchange. That's where uh the stable coins come in. They're not a store of value because they've got the same problem that any fiat currency has, but they are good for a medium of exchange. In fact, they're better than currency because, you know, you can transport it, you know, over the blockchain and, you know, over the internet. Uh but tokenized gold does it all. Tokenized gold is a store of value because it's gold and gold has actual value that can be stored. But tokenized gold is just as easy to uh function as a mean of exchange as tokenized dollars. So if you have the choice between tokenizing dollars and tokenizing gold, gold wins hands down. In fact, based on the new stable coin regulations in the US, stable coins don't even pay you interest. One of the reasons that people might keep dollars in savings as opposed to gold is that they can earn interest on their dollars and they don't get to earn interest on their gold. But, uh, tokenized gold and tokenized dollars, uh, compete evenly as far as interest rates because you don't get interest on either one. And you know, so uh if that's the case, you're much much better off using tokenized gold. So that is the future of stable coins. That is the future of crypto. It is tokenized gold. Tokenized gold makes gold better than it's ever been as money. It's always been a great store of value. And it's been good money, but it's even better money when you can tokenize tokenize it because then you can fractionalize it. you can break it down to tiny increments and it can be sent around the world at the speed of light uh cheaper and faster than you could uh do bitcoin or anything else. So that's where we're headed. I mean I'm moving in that direction too at shift gold. I've set up t-gold.com uh where people can go and buy gold and silver right now that will eventually be tokenized. But even before it's tokenized, I'm going to make it available too to be used as a direct medium of exchange where people that have accounts can send and receive gold and silver from other people who have accounts. So people can use it as a payment mechanism either to be paid or to make a payment uh instead of using other alternatives, but that allows them to stay in gold as a store of value between payments. Uh so this is where we're headed. uh the you know investors may not appreciate that yet because I'm ahead of the curve but that's where we're going >> and people can start now by going to t-old.com and and getting an account. >> No, you you make some fantastic points, Peter, and I'm with you. I think gold is the ultimate stable coin or it needs to be tokenized for for stable coins. In the meantime though, we got to talk about like how stable coins are impacting the US dollar because one could argue that stable coins make the dollar more accessible globally and maybe prolong the uh the ddollarization or the phase out. Um is is that an argument you would sign off on or is that something is like pulled on you know? >> No, I mean d I've been talking about ddollarization for decades now. To to me the surprise isn't that it's happening. The surprise is that it's taken so long. >> No, but I'm sorry, Peter, to jump in, but with with stable coins and the dollar, of course, many of them are backed by by US dollar and treasuries. Is that pushing out the the phase out like the there's a deadline? >> The transition into in into in into gold. Uh because I don't see a lot of dollars going into stable coins. Again, you give up all of your interest. So, if I've got a bunch of dollars in my brokerage account in a money market earning 4%, why do I need to t convert them into stable coins and earn nothing? Um, and I have no problem spending dollars. I don't need a stable coin. I mean, I'm in America. I mean, do I have a problem? I mean, paying in dollars and getting dollars. And see, I got so many different ways to use dollars. What the hell do I need a stable coin for? But if the stable coin is backed by gold, that I need. That's an improvement. You know, if I if I have a stable coin, a US dollar stable coin, I could use Benmo. I could use PayPal. I could use Zel. I could use my uh uh my Mastercard, my Visa. In fact, I'd rather use my Mastercard, my Visa, because I get a free loan and I get points that I could use for airline tickets or hotel reservations. So, why would I give up that for the stable coin? Now I might give it up for a stable coin that was gold because now I'm going to get the gain of gold. I'm going to get the preservation of my wealth. So that that is the real gamecher. The ability to use gold as money because using dollars as money, we already do that. That's that that there's nothing revolutionary about another way to spend my dollars and earn dollars. But a way to use gold that that you know that that that is a gamecher. Who would you trust to regulate a gold stable coin and to maybe run a process so that it's compatible? >> The free market doesn't need any regulation. I mean, it's gold. You know, you we already have laws against fraud, right? So, if you say your your token is backed one to one by gold. If it's not, you've broken the law, you know. But what what you do with a stable coin is you have independent audits that are easily verifiable. You have major accounting firms and then you get insurance and then the insurance companies audit it. You get a Lloyds a lender or somebody to insure the the account then they're going to audit it too. So there's all sorts of ways that the free market polices itself you and this the free market regulation is the best regulation. It's the most honest. It's the most reliable. All government regulation is corrupt because the the government regulators are corruptible and and so you know the market will work great and and there's no barriers to entry. Anybody could tokenize gold. So there'll be a lot of competition and the competition will keep people honest. >> I I was just going to ask that next part actually and you just opened the door to that. It's like how how many stable coins can co coexist and and be accepted as as forms of payments because you can't like how easy is it? I don't know. I keep using a baby. I mean if they're goldbacked they should all be funible with one another if they're all backed by the same commodity but ultimately yes you know in you know the markets will create a preference for brand right how many how many colas are there you know you got Coke you got Pepsi you know I don't know RC cola is a few right but I mean I mean there could be hundreds but ultimately the consumers are settling on a few so at the end of the day yes there's not necessarily going to be hundreds and hundreds of gold tokens out there uh there There will be some and the ones that are there are the ones that the consumers decide they trust. >> You know, it's >> it's a really interesting discussion. We could debate this probably for a while because I'm trying I'm trying to wrap my head around it like what would the consumer accept and then also like the receiver of of such stable coins meaning like the businesses and >> well you'd probably trust a Peter Shift token. You'd trust a shift stable coin stiff gold token >> probably. probably I'd have to inspect the vaults myself, but yes. No. Um, awesome, Peter. Super interesting discussion. Time just flew by. I can't believe it's already 30 minutes into the discussion here. Uh, a bit a bit of a different, you know, conversation, I guess, than than than usual. And I really appreciate your your your candid words here, Peter. Um, besides t-old.com, where else can our audience follow more of your work, Peter? >> Well, shiftgold.com to get the physical stuff. And if you want a portfolio that's managed by my team, uh we have uh several different strategies at Europe Pacific Asset Management, foreign dividend paying stocks, value stocks, foreign bonds, and our precious metal strategies. We also have five mutual funds, too. I don't know if Canadians can't really get those yet. We are working on an ETF that you guys should be able to buy. Um but we can accept accounts to manage for uh accredited Canadian investors, too. So, uh, they can go to europac.com and look at our strategies and talk to our representatives about setting up an account for us to manage. >> Fantastic. Awesome. Peter, tremendously appreciate your time as always. Thanks so much for coming on sore financially and we'll we'll have to do this again soon. I'll see you very latest though in New Orleans, I think. >> Yeah. Yeah. I accept it again. I got to leave a little early because it ends on Halloween. We got to get home for trick-or-treating. But, uh, >> fantastic. Awesome. >> We'll be We'll be there. >> Awesome. Looking forward to that. The very latest at the end of October. And then uh everybody else in the meantime, thank you so much for tuning in. What what do you think about stable coins? I find that a really fascinating topic because it's being hailed as the savior. We can issue more treasuries. The US dollar seems to be um more spread around the globe. Access is easier. I'm I'm really curious what your thoughts are about stable coins. Put them in the comments down below. Uh I want to discuss this a bit more as it seems to be a bit of a monetary revolution that is being pushed down our throat or shoved down our throats if we want to or not. Um, don't forget to hit that like and subscribe button as well. We tremendously appreciate it. Helps with the algorithm and we just yeah, as I said, appreciate it. Thank you so much for tuning in and don't let emotions run your investments for you. Take care out there.
The Dollar Crisis Goes Digital, GOLD Wins | Peter Schiff
Summary
Peter Schiff warns that investors are mispricing gold, silver and the entire U.S. debt situation. With U.S. debt approaching $40 …Transcript
What is the US doing about the debt problem? Nothing. In fact, they're not doing nothing. They're actually making it worse, which I guess counts as doing something. They have no understanding of the fiscal uh crisis that's coming and the sovereign debt crisis. It's not subprime borrowers who can't pay. It's the US government that can't pay. Yes, the US government can print. Uh but that creates the bigger problem. And that's why gold is the solution to that problem. A stable coin that's stable to the dollar has no stability because the dollar has no stability. What people don't realize, but they will eventually is that the stable coin industry is going to be dominated by gold. Tokenization of gold is the solution. The S&P 500 is rallying from record high to record high. Yet gold seems to be stuck at $4,500. It is consolidating. And there is so much we need to discuss in that regard. What is happening, of course, in the Middle East, but we need to talk about inflation, the US debt situation. We're nearing $40 trillion already. It could happen even before July 4th, the 250th birthday of the United States. That'd be an absolute insane milestone to achieve. I'm not sure that's an achievement, but a milestone to reach. And we need to discuss what that really means. What are the ramifications here? and how fragile is everything that we're seeing in markets right now. I've invited back Peter Schiff. He's the founder of Europe Pacific Capital Asset Management and of course an avid gold bug. He he knows the space like nobody else. And I'm really curious what his takeaway is. How is he reading the situation right now? Before I switch over to Peter though, hit that like and subscribe button. Helps us out tremendously with the algorithm of course and it helps us bring fantastic guests like Peter onto the program. Thanks so much for doing that. Now Peter, it's a great pleasure to welcome you back here on Soore Financially. Thanks so much for joining us again. >> Oh, thanks Kai. Always my pleasure to uh spend some time with you. >> Yeah, really looking forward to the next 30 minutes, Peter. We have lots to discuss, lots going on, of course. Um we need to maybe start with gold. Um lots happening in the world right now. Uh gold seems to be stuck though at $4,500. Um ignoring everything that that's happening around it. I just touched on a few points here in my intro, but uh how are you reading the gold price right now? I just think we're consolidating after a big breakout, both gold and silver. Uh, you know, gold broke out of 2000, which was really the the the cap. It got up near there in 2011 and then pulled back and then almost or just briefly got above 2,000 in 2020 and then pulled back and then it finally broke out for good in 2024 and we got as high as 5600 or so. Silver didn't break out until the end of last year, early this year, and it it had been stuck around 20, $30, and it went all the way up to 125, but it had a lot of resistance just below 50. And so, both metals have taken out the resistance. First silver, then gold, and now they're consolidating. Um, and I think the next move is another leg up. The only question is what's going to be the catalyst to break gold and silver out of the consolidation phase. Uh it may be a breakdown in the stock market. I mean right now it's risk on and everybody's buying tech stocks. It's also, you know, the war uh and people thinking that that means the Fed's not going to cut rates or they may hike rates and that's been a headwind. But what investors are missing is the tailwind of collapsing real rates. Because while the Fed has been talking about what they might may or may not do or in markets are speculating on what the Fed may or may not do, what we know they're not doing now is they're not hiking rates. But what is happening is inflation is rising. And that means real rates are falling. And that is very bullish for gold and silver. The question is when are traders going to figure this out? I was just going to say the market hasn't really realized that. Gloigree even went so far in our show to say the market is wrong um about that you know pricing it properly right >> the market gets a lot of stuff wrong initially in the long run you know it gets it right but in the short run it often gets it wrong and and that's what creates opportunities for investors if you can see circumstances where the market has it wrong like you know during the subprime bubble uh when it was clear to me and some others that the markets were mispricing subprime mortgages, they were trading for par and I thought they were worth zero. So, the market was wrong initially, but ultimately they got repriced to zero, which is where I thought they they should have been. And and so this is a similar situation in that uh investors are mispricing gold and silver. They're mispricing gold and silver related equities because they don't understand what's going to happen. They didn't understand what was going to happen to the real estate market and the consequence for real estate related debt. Uh and now they have no understanding of the fiscal uh crisis that's coming and the sovereign debt crisis. It's not subprime borrowers who can't pay, it's the US government that can't pay. Yes, the US government can print. Uh but that creates the bigger problem and that's why gold is the solution to that problem. Abs. >> Absolutely. And you just touched on real rates as well collapsing because we have rising inflation. We need to talk about that because typically inflation and rising inflation is good for gold but not in this case. It seems to make gold you know drop every time uh we we get more or higher oil prices meaning high possible higher inflation data. Um why is that correlation that used to be intact now broken? >> Yeah. again because people are thinking about how the Fed will react to the higher inflation numbers and they perceive that as a negative for gold. And one of the reasons that gold had a big rally was the expectation that the Fed would be cutting rates. And now that those expectations have been uh tempered and in fact replaced with the expectation of hikes, but all that is really noise uh because what's really driving gold and silver is is not that the Fed was going to be cutting rates, but that inflation was north of its 2% target and never going to get back. And in fact, uh, you know, we're we're going to be printing, uh, inflation numbers much higher than 2% as far as the eye can see. And that's going to be the driver, uh, for gold. It's going to be the need to escape the loss of purchasing power that you will suffer if you hold US dollars or any debt instruments denominated in dollars because the yield that you earn will not be high enough to compensate you for the purchasing power that you lose. like the the market is is completely ignoring what we just discussed here as as you said like it's completely maybe misunderstanding ignoring um the fact that that gold still is your your protector. It reacts and the gold price story reacts very aggressively even to to headline news to to the noise out there like when can it decouple like like we've seen before like we need that decoupling to happen again. >> Yeah, I don't know. I mean there's going to be a catalyst. something's going to happen to break gold and silver out of their respective consolidations. Um, it'll be obvious in hindsight once it happens, but you know, it'll it'll be it could be anything. I just don't know. I just know it's going to happen. Uh, you know, and so eventually something will will set it off. You know, just like I always thought oil prices were going to go up. I thought bond yields would go up. The catalyst for the recent move was the Iran war. But if it hadn't been that, it would have been something else. And and that's where I think a lot of people are making a mistake, too. They think, well, when the war is over, oil prices are going to come right down. Bond yields are going to come down. I don't think so. There may be a knee-jerk reaction where you get a bit of a move down in oil prices and down in bond yields, but it won't last. And I think the upward trend in both is going to continue long after the war ends. Uh if it ends, you know, who knows at this point. Now, as you said, like gold is trading back like it is a commodity, right? It's not trading like it's a there's a system change upon us or a financial reset like so many have forecast as well. Which brings me to the debt situation in general. Um 40 almost 40 trillion. You you just mentioned it 39.3 I think you you said before we hit the record button. Uh is the US debt situation as well. All of these facts are being ignored by by gold right now. Or is that all priced in? Is it ignored or priced in? That's the question. Look, you you you asked earlier in the interview, what is the US doing about the debt problem? Nothing. In fact, they're not doing nothing. They're actually making it worse, which I guess counts as doing something, but they're not doing something about the problem. They're doing something to make the problem bigger. And in fact, you know, uh, the former secretary of the treasury, Hank Pollson, he recently said that the US needs to develop a break the glass emergency plan to deal with the crisis that is inevitable once foreigners don't want to buy our bonds. And this is coming from a prior Secretary of the Treasury. So, it's not like it's Peter Schiff saying it. somebody who was an insider uh under Bush, you know, sounding the alarm. And the most interesting thing about Paulson's uh saying that we need this plan is what he didn't say. He didn't say, "Hey, there's going to be a crisis one day when foreigners don't want to buy our bonds. So, let's act now to prevent that crisis. Let's get our fiscal house in order so we don't need a break the glass emergency plan. Let's try to preempt the emergency. Let's show the world that we're serious about tackling our debt. Let's cut government spending. You know, let's do something." Now, he didn't even bother to suggest that because he knows it's never going to happen. He has resigned himself to the inevitable. We are never going to take preemptive actions. We're never going to get the debt under control. We're not going to cut spending. We are going to keep the pedal to the metal until this car goes off the edge of a cliff. He just wants us to be able to do something, you know, you know, before it hits the the the the ground, before the, you know, um but I I just don't think there's anything you could do. I don't see an emergency plan working. I think by the time you need to break the glass, it's too late. >> Well Well, they've tried at least Doge was a was a try, but it failed miserably, of course, because politics, right? It just doesn't work. Um, which brings me sort of I wouldn't say the next topic, but it's a good segue to talk about the next or the current new Fed chair. Um, the question though is Peter, is he already trapped? Is he in a no losing position there? >> Yeah. I mean, Kevin Walsh, yeah, I mean, he's he's uh he's between and Iran in a hard place, I guess. Uh, but, you know, there's nothing that he could do. uh you know the markets expect the Fed to be cutting rates even if the next move may be a hike. Uh everybody assumes that's just a war related uh temporary situation. But the marching orders that Trump gave everybody who was under consideration uh was you start cutting rates. That's your job to cut rates. And even though at the confirmation, not the confirmation hearing, at the inauguration, uh Trump said, "Look, you know, Kevin, do your own thing. I trust you. Don't look at me. Just do whatever you want." You know, obviously that's not the case because that wasn't the case uh with with uh Powell and Trump appointed Pal and he beat the crap out of him, you know, for not not cutting rates. So why is Walsh going to get the benefit of the doubt that that he didn't extend uh to Pal? Um so I think that was all for the cameras and for the Forex traders and you know to try to you know under the table I'm sure they got a a handshake deal like hey buddy you know you know what you're there to do. Um, but he's in a bad position because, you know, the markets want this, but he can't deliver it without destroying the dollar um and and the bond market, which would force him to quantitative easing, which is something that he has opposed correctly in the past. But now he's going to be in charge of ramping up the program because if he doesn't do it, then, you know, we have a financial crisis. If he does do it, we have something worse. But Trump obviously is going to be pressuring him. But, you know, there there's no way out. I don't think the Fed can do what it did in 2020 to bail out COVID or in 2008 for the financial crisis. I don't think the next round of QE is going to work the way the last rounds did. I I think that the market is going to reject it. and and so it's going to create a bigger problem than the one they're trying to solve. >> I I want to talk about the dollar because I think it's it's an interesting one because I'm trying to figure out like what what role does it play in general and what does the White House want to achieve because I remember President Trump saying in his first term he does want a weaker dollar. So the question is like what what is weaker? Let's let's use the Dixie for example um where we're right around 100 again. Um what what what is weaker and how much wiggle room is there before the currency fails, Peter? >> Yeah. Well, the problem is, you know, Trump wants his dollar cake and then he wants to eat it too, which you can't have. He wants a weaker dollar, but he wants a stronger dollar at the same time. You know, he wants a weaker dollar because he thinks that helps our our balance of trade. It makes it easier for us to sell products abroad and it makes imports more expensive. So, he thinks it'll help with the trade deficit. But he also knows that we need the dollar as the reserve currency. He knows that that's key uh to our ability to finance our trade deficits and to finance our budget deficits. And our whole standard of living is predicated on the dollar being the reserve currency. Yet, in order for it to maintain its reserve status, it needs to stay strong because the people think the dollar is going to weaken. They're not going to want to hold it. So, they have to have confidence that it's not going to weaken. So, how do you have a weak dollar and a strong dollar at the same time? Right? Obviously, you can't. Um, but you know, I think we're going to get a weak dollar whether the president wants it or not. Uh, and it's going to be a big problem. And I think the dollar is in the process of losing its reserve status. And I don't think there's any way to abort that process. I think it's going to continue. And you know, there's an old saying about how you go broke uh slowly at first and then all at once. And we've been in the slowly part for a while. Uh the all at once part is coming. I get I just don't know when. But I want to be prepared. >> Like with the military action over the last let's say five six months here uh from the US, have they strengthened the position of the dollar the petro dollar uh in the global system? or have they maybe pushed back that that phase out? >> I think we've exposed the weakness because we barely got a bounce out of the dollar because of the war and the dollar is about where it was before the war. Um, and we may lose the war. That's the problem is, you know, we know Iran is not going away. We're not getting regime change. I mean, that was clearly a goal that Trump established and we're not going to get that goal. The only thing we may get, and we may not even get that, is some kind of nuclear deal. Uh, but I think America's status in the Gulf is going to be diminished as a result of the fact that we couldn't get rid of the Iranian government, that they that they withstood all of our bombs and all of our missiles. And in fact, Iran may emerge from this with more influence and power in the region and we have less. uh and they may be in an even better economic position. They may have fewer sanctions or no sanctions. They may have control of the straight of Hermuz. They may be charging tolls. Who the hell knows? Uh but I think all this ultimately diminishes our status. Um and it weakens the dollar even further. >> But it's not accelerating the dilization trend. >> No, I don't know. I mean, I think the trend was already there. um whether it accelerates it or not, you know, it's hard to say it might. Uh it's going to accelerate itself. I mean, it's just going to snowball, right? Because, you know, as it rolls down the hill, it gets bigger and bigger and bigger. Uh and so, you know, we're ultimately our own worst enemy. I think what Biden did and then Trump did more of it by weaponizing the dollar and and sanctioning people that we don't like that that accelerated the process. Um, you know, >> no, absolutely. Kicking, you know, Russia out of the Swift system definitely like kicked off that pro or accelerated the the phase. >> Yeah. Because it not only it not only gave Russia an incentive to get the hell out of the dollar, but it gave everybody else an incentive because they didn't want to be the next Russia. It was like an example of what could happen. And you know, so the rest, you know, Russia was the uh you know, you know, took it for everybody else, right? They they suffered, but it was a wake-up call to everybody else that hey, you know, get rid of your dollars now or this could happen to you. >> Absolutely. No, and that's why I think we've seen central banks buy gold hand over fist and uh coming back. >> Yeah. The only way the US government could take your gold is to actually invade you if you have the gold there. Now, if you store it at the Fed, they could take that. But if you physically bury the gold in the ground in your own vaults, you you know, there's nothing the US government can do. They if you have US treasuries, they got you. They can do whatever the hell they want. They don't have to pay those treasuries. They could they could default. They could selectively default on the ones that you own. They could freeze the dollars that you've got. Uh so you know why would you want to give so much power to the US especially if if the US regards you as an enemy right if you're China and we have all this anti-China rhetoric you know China's our big enemy and yet China's holding on to all these dollars and all these you know dollar denominated bonds why would you want to be in that vulnerable position if you're our enemy why would you want to give us that weapon to use against you >> Peter since you brought China into the mix of the conversation here just just real quick. Uh um are you surprised um disappointed perhaps by the outcome of the the she meeting in in Beijing there? >> Well, I'm not surprised at all that nothing came out of it. I mean, it was all a photo op uh for, you know, for Trump. I mean, they could have just had a Zoom call. I mean, what did they get out of it? >> What was the famous >> This could have been an email. >> Well, yeah. I mean, look, China's going to buy some planes from from Boeing. What else? I mean, of course, they buy planes from Boeing. what else they could do with their dollars. I mean, Boeing makes decent planes. China needs planes, you know, so they're going to buy Boeing planes. You know, the funnier part was the agriculture deal. You know, Trump made a big deal. Oh, we got the Chinese to commit to buying 17 billion of US agriculture over the over the next two years. So, what when Biden was president, they averaged over 30 billion a year. I mean, 17 billion is about half of what they used to buy before his tariffs blew up our export market. uh exports to China of agriculture collapsed in 2025 because of the tariffs. And now Trump succeeds in getting China to agree to buy half of what it was buying before the tariffs. And he's saying this is this great deal that he negotiated. Um you know on behalf of the farmers uh you know thanks thanks for the help. Um so you know it this is a fake a fake victory you know uh that he's that he's uh that he's claiming. So, no, I don't think anything came out of this. >> Uh, I'm curious, Peter, like do do you think the US has actually managed to strengthen its position versus China um over the last say 18 months? >> No, I think we've weakened our position. You know, we backed away from a lot of the tariffs and then others were declared unconstitutional. We still have some tariffs, but look, China's exports are growing. They're not shrinking. Yes, their exports to the US are going down, but they're exporting more to the rest of the world, and that makes the US less important for the Chinese, and that is a problem because we need America to be important to China. So, they'll keep buying our bonds and loaning us money. Uh, but if they realize they don't need our market as much, well, then they don't lend us as much. They don't buy our financial assets. But we're also dependent on China, not just for financing. But the goods that the Chinese manufacture are not goods that we can produce ourselves. I mean maybe in in in the future if we invested enough in building the plants and building out the required uh infrastructure and supply chains and training the workers. But all that is going to take years and years and years and cost a lot of money that we don't have. Um, so I think what's happening is just revealing how dependent the United States is on China uh for manufactured goods and the fact that China doesn't need to sell those goods to Americans who can't afford them. There's an entire world out there that they can sell to. And if they allow the dollar to collapse, which I think they ultimately will and you see a big rise in the Chinese R&B, it's the Chinese consumers that are going to be buying all the stuff that Americans can't afford. And so rather than exporting what they produce, a lot more of what they produce will be consumed domestically uh by their own citizens. And and that's a much better deal for China than just getting our inflation. >> No, absolutely. I think that's what the US wants though as well. wants the China to produce and consume more. Consume >> be careful what you wish for because what the Chinese consume, Americans can't consume, you know. You know, I mean, what's America going to look like when all the shelves at Walmart and and Amazon are empty? You know, you think you think the cost of living is high now. Wait till you see how much more expensive it's going to get when that happens. >> No, absolutely. Uh it's it's an interesting one. You can't live without the other. you know, it's a lovehate relationship, >> right? Um, no, Peter, um, you touched on the bond market earlier and I really want to talk about stable coins as well because I think that's the segue and it's a topic we haven't really discussed yet with you um, on the channel. Uh, because it's being hailed as an absolute financial savior uh, maybe is is it a savior, the dollar savior, or is it more of a trap? Actually, Peter, what do you make of stable coins? A stable coin that's stable to the dollar has no stability because the dollar has no stability. What people don't realize, but they will eventually is that the stable coin industry is going to be dominated by gold. Tokenization of gold is the solution. It solves the problem uh that Bitcoin can't or the stable coins can't. See, Bitcoin was sold as a store of value. Uh, but it's not a store of value because it has no value that you could store. But even the people who buy Bitcoin concede it's not a good medium of exchange. That's where uh the stable coins come in. They're not a store of value because they've got the same problem that any fiat currency has, but they are good for a medium of exchange. In fact, they're better than currency because, you know, you can transport it, you know, over the blockchain and, you know, over the internet. Uh but tokenized gold does it all. Tokenized gold is a store of value because it's gold and gold has actual value that can be stored. But tokenized gold is just as easy to uh function as a mean of exchange as tokenized dollars. So if you have the choice between tokenizing dollars and tokenizing gold, gold wins hands down. In fact, based on the new stable coin regulations in the US, stable coins don't even pay you interest. One of the reasons that people might keep dollars in savings as opposed to gold is that they can earn interest on their dollars and they don't get to earn interest on their gold. But, uh, tokenized gold and tokenized dollars, uh, compete evenly as far as interest rates because you don't get interest on either one. And you know, so uh if that's the case, you're much much better off using tokenized gold. So that is the future of stable coins. That is the future of crypto. It is tokenized gold. Tokenized gold makes gold better than it's ever been as money. It's always been a great store of value. And it's been good money, but it's even better money when you can tokenize tokenize it because then you can fractionalize it. you can break it down to tiny increments and it can be sent around the world at the speed of light uh cheaper and faster than you could uh do bitcoin or anything else. So that's where we're headed. I mean I'm moving in that direction too at shift gold. I've set up t-gold.com uh where people can go and buy gold and silver right now that will eventually be tokenized. But even before it's tokenized, I'm going to make it available too to be used as a direct medium of exchange where people that have accounts can send and receive gold and silver from other people who have accounts. So people can use it as a payment mechanism either to be paid or to make a payment uh instead of using other alternatives, but that allows them to stay in gold as a store of value between payments. Uh so this is where we're headed. uh the you know investors may not appreciate that yet because I'm ahead of the curve but that's where we're going >> and people can start now by going to t-old.com and and getting an account. >> No, you you make some fantastic points, Peter, and I'm with you. I think gold is the ultimate stable coin or it needs to be tokenized for for stable coins. In the meantime though, we got to talk about like how stable coins are impacting the US dollar because one could argue that stable coins make the dollar more accessible globally and maybe prolong the uh the ddollarization or the phase out. Um is is that an argument you would sign off on or is that something is like pulled on you know? >> No, I mean d I've been talking about ddollarization for decades now. To to me the surprise isn't that it's happening. The surprise is that it's taken so long. >> No, but I'm sorry, Peter, to jump in, but with with stable coins and the dollar, of course, many of them are backed by by US dollar and treasuries. Is that pushing out the the phase out like the there's a deadline? >> The transition into in into in into gold. Uh because I don't see a lot of dollars going into stable coins. Again, you give up all of your interest. So, if I've got a bunch of dollars in my brokerage account in a money market earning 4%, why do I need to t convert them into stable coins and earn nothing? Um, and I have no problem spending dollars. I don't need a stable coin. I mean, I'm in America. I mean, do I have a problem? I mean, paying in dollars and getting dollars. And see, I got so many different ways to use dollars. What the hell do I need a stable coin for? But if the stable coin is backed by gold, that I need. That's an improvement. You know, if I if I have a stable coin, a US dollar stable coin, I could use Benmo. I could use PayPal. I could use Zel. I could use my uh uh my Mastercard, my Visa. In fact, I'd rather use my Mastercard, my Visa, because I get a free loan and I get points that I could use for airline tickets or hotel reservations. So, why would I give up that for the stable coin? Now I might give it up for a stable coin that was gold because now I'm going to get the gain of gold. I'm going to get the preservation of my wealth. So that that is the real gamecher. The ability to use gold as money because using dollars as money, we already do that. That's that that there's nothing revolutionary about another way to spend my dollars and earn dollars. But a way to use gold that that you know that that that is a gamecher. Who would you trust to regulate a gold stable coin and to maybe run a process so that it's compatible? >> The free market doesn't need any regulation. I mean, it's gold. You know, you we already have laws against fraud, right? So, if you say your your token is backed one to one by gold. If it's not, you've broken the law, you know. But what what you do with a stable coin is you have independent audits that are easily verifiable. You have major accounting firms and then you get insurance and then the insurance companies audit it. You get a Lloyds a lender or somebody to insure the the account then they're going to audit it too. So there's all sorts of ways that the free market polices itself you and this the free market regulation is the best regulation. It's the most honest. It's the most reliable. All government regulation is corrupt because the the government regulators are corruptible and and so you know the market will work great and and there's no barriers to entry. Anybody could tokenize gold. So there'll be a lot of competition and the competition will keep people honest. >> I I was just going to ask that next part actually and you just opened the door to that. It's like how how many stable coins can co coexist and and be accepted as as forms of payments because you can't like how easy is it? I don't know. I keep using a baby. I mean if they're goldbacked they should all be funible with one another if they're all backed by the same commodity but ultimately yes you know in you know the markets will create a preference for brand right how many how many colas are there you know you got Coke you got Pepsi you know I don't know RC cola is a few right but I mean I mean there could be hundreds but ultimately the consumers are settling on a few so at the end of the day yes there's not necessarily going to be hundreds and hundreds of gold tokens out there uh there There will be some and the ones that are there are the ones that the consumers decide they trust. >> You know, it's >> it's a really interesting discussion. We could debate this probably for a while because I'm trying I'm trying to wrap my head around it like what would the consumer accept and then also like the receiver of of such stable coins meaning like the businesses and >> well you'd probably trust a Peter Shift token. You'd trust a shift stable coin stiff gold token >> probably. probably I'd have to inspect the vaults myself, but yes. No. Um, awesome, Peter. Super interesting discussion. Time just flew by. I can't believe it's already 30 minutes into the discussion here. Uh, a bit a bit of a different, you know, conversation, I guess, than than than usual. And I really appreciate your your your candid words here, Peter. Um, besides t-old.com, where else can our audience follow more of your work, Peter? >> Well, shiftgold.com to get the physical stuff. And if you want a portfolio that's managed by my team, uh we have uh several different strategies at Europe Pacific Asset Management, foreign dividend paying stocks, value stocks, foreign bonds, and our precious metal strategies. We also have five mutual funds, too. I don't know if Canadians can't really get those yet. We are working on an ETF that you guys should be able to buy. Um but we can accept accounts to manage for uh accredited Canadian investors, too. So, uh, they can go to europac.com and look at our strategies and talk to our representatives about setting up an account for us to manage. >> Fantastic. Awesome. Peter, tremendously appreciate your time as always. Thanks so much for coming on sore financially and we'll we'll have to do this again soon. I'll see you very latest though in New Orleans, I think. >> Yeah. Yeah. I accept it again. I got to leave a little early because it ends on Halloween. We got to get home for trick-or-treating. But, uh, >> fantastic. Awesome. >> We'll be We'll be there. >> Awesome. Looking forward to that. The very latest at the end of October. And then uh everybody else in the meantime, thank you so much for tuning in. What what do you think about stable coins? I find that a really fascinating topic because it's being hailed as the savior. We can issue more treasuries. The US dollar seems to be um more spread around the globe. Access is easier. I'm I'm really curious what your thoughts are about stable coins. Put them in the comments down below. Uh I want to discuss this a bit more as it seems to be a bit of a monetary revolution that is being pushed down our throat or shoved down our throats if we want to or not. Um, don't forget to hit that like and subscribe button as well. We tremendously appreciate it. Helps with the algorithm and we just yeah, as I said, appreciate it. Thank you so much for tuning in and don't let emotions run your investments for you. Take care out there.