E.B. Tucker: How the Investors Who Win Actually Think | Your Beliefs May Be Costing You Money
Summary
Urban Air Mobility: Bullish on vertical electric flying taxis becoming mainstream, with routes like Miami–Palm Beach and San Diego–LA and seamless booking via major apps; expects significant capital inflows to the space.
Bitcoin: Advocates a small allocation (e.g., ~5%) as a long-term hold, citing persistent negativity, relatively small market cap versus major asset classes, and potential for institutional adoption.
Gold: Recommends owning some gold as portfolio ballast, while questioning extreme price targets; focuses on practical allocation rather than maximalist views.
Silver: Acknowledges potential upside (discusses a move toward $100) but highlights storage/handling burdens and warns against becoming a “bug” fixated on a single asset.
Gold Miners: Notes that despite a ~60% rise in gold to around $4,200/oz, miners underperformed prior expectations; cautions on industry dilution, governance, and the gap between metal prices and equity performance.
Market Structure: Argues capitalism/value investing is effectively “dead,” with markets driven by narrative, derivatives, and policy nudges; sees digitization (stablecoins/Fedcoin) and a controlled dollar decline as the likely path.
Portfolio Approach: Emphasizes a marathon mindset with pie-chart allocations across uncorrelated assets to enhance stability and long-term compounding, avoiding swing-for-the-fences behavior.
Stock-Picking Stance: No specific tickers were pitched on-air; focus remained on themes with asymmetry (Bitcoin, gold, and flying taxis) and identifying what the crowd will chase next.
Transcript
You've got two types of people, you know, one type of person brings their idea of how things ought to be into the market and then the other type of person walks in and says, "What's going on here?" And, you know, then figures out, "What should we do about it?" And the second person in that equation tends to make a lot more money. Don't forget to sign up for a free portfolio review with one of our endorsed investment partners at wealthon.comfree. >> Well, greetings and welcome to our wealthy show. My name is Trey Reich and I'm here today with EB Tucker, the I would say freewheeling freeth thinker uh who is the editor of the fascinating publication the Tucker Letter. Uh I'm 65 years old. I'm a career institutional investor and I've spent the past quarter century investing in precious metals and all I can say is I really wish I had encountered your philosophy, way of thinking and spiritual code a bit earlier in my life because it might have helped me traverse the highs and lows of precious metal investings uh over the last quarter century. So I've really enjoyed uh getting to know your work. Thanks for being with us today. >> Thanks for having me and thanks for the generous introduction. And all I'll say back to you is is that it's never too late. It's it's it's only you know it's relative, right? Like too late >> too late for uh one person is is too soon for another. >> Very good advice. Um, so, uh, again, I I'm a little out of sorts in, uh, I actually spent more time looking at your stuff, researching what you've done than I think I have for any other guest ever because it's so fascinating and it's so broad. Um, but if I were to try to reduce what I've learned over the last couple of days, I'd summarize your investment philosophy as don't fight it. Be flexible. pay attention to what's going on. Uh, is that fair? >> Sure. I mean, I I I I I love when you say you're out of sorts because I tal I gave a speech at a conference last year, institutional conference, and the first person that raised their hand said, "Are you on mushrooms?" And and I I I actually I said, you know, I don't take any mood and mindaltering substances. and not for any moral reason whatsoever, but I just like at one point had to decide that I was going to just ride the wave, you know, totally natural and it was just what I did. But I thought it was like the best question ever. So when you said you were out of sorts, I was I was thinking you were going to say, "Is this guy on drugs?" But the answer is I'm not on drugs. Um I I think what's happened is I figured out at some point that you've got two types of people. You know, one type of person brings their idea of how things ought to be into the market. And then the other type of person walks in and says, "What's going on here?" And, you know, then figures out, "What should we do about it?" And the second person in that equation tends to make a lot more money. And then people say, "Well, you're just about money." And it's like, I I got to tell you, money doesn't fix problems. And um what's weird about money, too, is that sometimes it's a curse. Like you see some of these people and they just make this shrine to these money ideas and they it just kills them. >> And so what has occurred to me and I wrote this in my second book you I wrote a lot about this topic in my second book not for sale which I don't think really anyone read but basically the the the point is is that the money just doesn't matter. I mean if you can get your head right about how you're going to think about investment decisions you're going to do fine. like you're gonna make enough money, you're gonna do fine. You're gonna you might have to work a little bit, you know? I mean, everybody's always like thinks that I'm really rich. And I'm like, well, what is really rich? I mean, I know some people that are that are like really really rich and like they haven't driven themselves in 20 years and and they've got a lot of problems sometimes. And then sometimes I know people that that that aren't rich enough, you know, they should probably be at work, you know, and then there's like a huge spectrum in between, you know, and it's like quit worrying about what's rich and what's not rich and there's not like an investment or a trade that's going to change your life because when you walk into the market and you say, you know, I need it to change my life, like you're you're going to get really hurt. I mean, that's not what the market does, you know. And I think as soon as you start thinking about this stuff and stop leaving nasty comments that you, you know, you want a stock tip and anybody that doesn't give it to you is just like gets pie in the face, you're going to make lots of money. I mean, like, because that's when you see Trey, that's when you see what's really going on. And once you see what's going on, you can't unsee it. That's the thing is that you're like, "Oh, now I get it." You know, and then once you get it, it just looks easy. >> It really looks easy. I mean know like we're generating returns right now that when I was a kid I used to watch Lewis Rookheiser's Wall Street which you probably remember I thought he was the coolest guy and mostly because of his his outfits you know he wore those like like really you know big three-piece suits or whatever but I remember if you had told that guy you would have stocks in the Tucker letter portfolio we have a stock uh like kind of a picks and shovels AI thing that's up like I don't know 40% or something since like you know September and you're just like get out of here man. I mean that's like imagine that you know going back to like the days when we were investing like capitalists and we were kind of counting on companies to like you know grow the business and manage the debt properly and like build shareholder equity and then we say yeah we made 40% since September and it's not enough. Can you imagine? I mean like it's crazy. And so I think I think when you can like zoom out and kind of like see this for what it is, it starts to get much easier. >> So I think uh one way that I might rephrase what you just said to make sure I'm getting the theme is f you mentioned repeatedly that people are too focused on trying to hit the ultimate home run and in doing so they're distracted uh by seeing the forest through the trees. Is that fair? >> Pretty much. I mean, the thing is, I've hit a couple of really intense home runs, and not one of them did I get, you know, wake up thinking I'm going to go hit a home run on this. Most of the home runs that I hit that were like the 100x things, I thought, this is really dumb and I'm going to and I'm going to invest an amount of money that doesn't make me feel really dumb when it doesn't work out. And then it just went like kaboom. But that's what I'm trying to say to people is like you got to get your head right about what you're doing. and and and once you do, you're going to see how this thing works and then it's just going to be one after another. I mean, if you read the newsletter, it's like a marathon. It's like it's not a sprint, you know, and it's like people have a lot of preconceived notions, but it's like we've been doing this for a long time and uh I've done a couple different things in my career and you know, writing newsletters has been my favorite thing to do. And I mean, you can like find, you know, archives going way way back and it's like we got to play the cycles as they come up. I mean, I want to slide into like one thing that's related to this because sometimes, as you know, from catching up on the recent issues. I'll kind of give people like a little bit of an algebra equation of like what's I'm kind of like when I was a kid, my dad was like, you really got to learn algebra, which made no sense to me. And he was like, once you see the equation, then everything starts to kind of like fit into equations and you're just going to realize that like this is very helpful stuff. And I just thought that was crazy. But now I'm like, man, he really knew what he was talking about, right? So, one of the things that I do this time of year, and I don't want to spoil the next newsletter, but I've talked about this a little bit. It's like I look around at the universe of things you can invest in, it's like, what is everything worth? You know, I I'm really bothered sort of by like the gold you I I was in the gold business for a little while and sort of involved in some companies. I'm I'm not really involved in that at all. I haven't been for some time. And one of the things I don't understand is that people are like pounding the table for for much higher gold prices. And it's like gold's worth $30 trillion. I mean that that's like that number could be off by a little bit but that's like a pretty close number you know if you go by all the world gold numbers of what's in the ground whatever but $30 trillion well the stock market's worth 72 trillion okay so and then the the global that's the US the global stock market I'd say is another 50 trillion or something and then the US housing market is like 55 trillion which I think is a little high because like US housing is like really stuck and I I would challenge anyone you know to to to to prove me wrong on this but What I'm seeing is a lot of people waiting for rates to come down, waiting for a catalyst where so 55 trillion is generous and then the treasury's got 38 trillion and then Bitcoin's worth like 1.8 trillion. And so I watch these guys talk about like gold's going to 10,000 and I'm just like maybe I mean I mean probably someday, right? But like what is the like the silver people like what is the point in holding out for 15 years for a double? I mean, what is actually we we're talking about there's stocks in the Tucker letter portfolio went up like 40% in seven or eight weeks. I mean, like, and that's like an accident, right? I mean, that's like a large company going up. It's like, whoa. Okay, that that that gets our attention. But what is the point of like holding out for that? And then double what is the point if you look at gold and you're like, you know, it's 30 trillion. Is it going to go to like, you know, 80 trillion or something? Is it going to be worth more than all the stocks? I mean, I don't really understand people's negativity about stocks. And it doesn't mean that I'm like all bowled up on stocks. What I'm saying is that like the average American really likes to think about a crash. And it's like, okay, I mean, you have this scenario where the stock market is like our checkbook, you know, for like, you know, businesses and for people and everything, right? like like the they've made it they're giving infants they're giving infants stock accounts so that pe they can they can they can like you know make everybody equal. You've read about this I'm sure. So you really think this is going to crash? Well, what is it going to crash? Is it going to fall in half? Well, if it fell in half then it would be worth what gold's worth. >> And and and and you know nobody likes gold more than me, right? But like the the reality is is that like the opportunistic time to buy gold was when I wrote the book about gold. I mean, that was like, you know, like nearly tripled now. And it's like everybody I'm just like, what are people pounding the table about? You know, I think like you need to own some gold. You don't really need that much gold. And you need to probably need to own some Bitcoin. And nobody wants to do that right now. And we've been writing in the newsletter that all these like token bros, you know, that are renting Lamborghinis and buying like, you know, like obscure 13,000 different obscure tokens probably aren't going to be the ones that come out on top of this. It's probably going to be the people that say, "You know what I'm going to do? I'm going to probably take like a 5% allocation to Bitcoin and I'm just going to just do nothing with it." I mean, I said that like if you did that with gold, I mean, you know this because you've been around for a while. Like if you did that with gold and it was like 500, 600, 800,000, 1,200, 1500, you're just like, "Let me just take like a 5% allocation." You killed it. >> You killed it. And then your stock investing got better because your portfolio was like more stable. It It didn't have like whiplash all the time. And so what I'm the reason I'm putting that all out there to you is not to say buy Bitcoin. I actually don't think it's totally essential to buy Bitcoin. What I'm saying is that I listen to people, Trey. I listen to what they say and then I'm like, what are they even talking about? I mean, like let's look at the value of everything, you know? Like I don't think anybody does that, you know? And it's like it's like Bitcoin's like a like a like a a early teenager, >> right? you know, and the people involved. I mean, like they're they're just going to get like some of these people are leverage, going to get washed out. What does that tell you? That tells you that like there's some people that have a hundred million bucks are like, you know, my kids been telling me about this for 10 years. I should probably buy like a million dollars worth of I mean, this is like serious money becoming involved. And then people talk about like the rug coming out from under it. I'm just like maybe maybe but I mean I mean I I think having 5% exposure and being subject to the rug coming off under you it's two different things you know it's kind of like you know if they figure out how to from space find all the gold in the ground which I think they're going to be able to do at some point the value of gold would go down right because it would be like oh we discovered this pile of it over here and like the supply went up. Do you get what I'm saying? I mean, this happened with oil, remember? It's like we're going to run out of oil, then we, you know, commercialize shell production and the oil's $58 a barrel and like you're swimming in the stuff. Anyway, my point is is that like if you want to really succeed, I mean, if you want to like if you want to really be rich, the way to do it is to run a marathon. And on a marathon, you just you just outpace everybody, man. They just drop dead like like slowly year after year. people swing for the fences and they burn out their cash and they do like crazy things and you just don't have to do that. And it's and it's it's also it's not boring to do what we're talking about like to have like proper allocations to different things and to like keep up with things. How about this one? To read stuff so you can learn. How about that? Nobody does that. They're like, "Let me get a cracker jack box with a prize at the bottom. This a stock ticker. I'm not going to know when to sell it and I'm just gonna blame everybody when I don't make enough money to fix all my problems. That person is just going to get washed out at the first time it rains they're gone. And you don't want to be that person. And you know what the good news is? Is you don't have to be that person >> because it's like all you got to do I mean we're telling you what to do. You know like every issue of the Tucker letter it's like all you got to do is read and nobody wants to read anymore. They're like let me get a summary of it. It's like come on. I mean, you can ask AI to summarize it for you, but you're not going to get the full monty. You got to read. >> By the way, I still write 12, 13 page letters, so I'm very familiar with that. I have been told a million times, you should do a podcast and whenever I ask people if my if they've read my letter, they go, I skimmed it. I've heard the word skim more often than my middle name. >> Yeah. I mean, I mean, I I'm always tempted to put, you know, put a put a check in the in the margin if you're reading this right now, you know, like remember that's what we did in the 80s. We did that with our teachers. We would we would write that into the paper, you know, and then they would put like a giant X over there because we were being clowns, you know. But the thing is, people don't understand. You write because you have to write. >> That's why you write. You don't write as some kind of like stunt or something or to make money. I write a newsletter because that's what I do. I write the newsletter. I don't really care if a million people read the newsletter or a thousand people read the newsletter. I write it because I'm the writer. And and when I was reading stuff, like I remember reading Doug Casey's letter, you know, like 20 plus years ago when he would write this story about getting like lost in Cambodia somewhere and I was like mesmerized. >> I mean, I was like, this is like the best story I've ever read in my life. I wasn't reading that for a stock pick. I mean, sure, I liked things he said about like how to present as a wealthy person in the making and stuff. I like that. You know, I was interested in that. But what I really liked was getting wrapped up in a story. I thought it was a lot of fun. And, you know, then I ended up meeting him in 2009 at a lunch that he doesn't remember. And then I ended up uh working for someone else that bought his company. And so, we got back together and I worked for And so, like my point is that's called a journey. That's a marathon. That's not like one thing that you learned. I mean that that's like, you know, years of doing something fun and then when you do something fun, magic happens. And you can do that in the market, too. >> Bill Bonner, the daily reckoning. I'm sure you read that for years as well. >> I used to write Bill's monthly letter when he started a monthly there. You know, he was like, I I I can't, you know, I don't know how to do a monthly because it's like a different format. He's a daily guy, right? >> And so they put me with him and I wrote that for him. And Bill's like, you know, he's got like nine houses. First thing he tells you too is he's like a simple man. I'm like, "Built, nine houses and simplicity don't completely mix, but I'll let you go ahead and wear that hat, you know, because he's he's like the coolest guy ever, you know, but um >> he still fance a journey. >> He'sard he still favors France, >> couple places in France, big place in Argentina, you know, he's all over the place and uh and nothing's dramatic. I mean, I don't want you get the wrong idea, but I mean, you know, we would we would convene in these places and like, you know, drink coffee and, you know, walk around, do pull-ups. And so, I mean, it was just the the most fun job I ever had, you know, at the time. And uh and all those guys are just great. But the reality is is they write because they write. That's what they do, you know, and if you read for a while, you you're going to learn a lot of stuff, you know, and it's like you're going to there's a magic in in taking a walk with a writer. And that's a lot of people don't get that, you know. Then the other thing, let me just tell you one more thing about this industry that I think surprises people is a lot of the big heavily marketed newsletters, not the ones that we've been talking about, but like things that are coming out right now, they're written by like standin ghostriters. And a lot of times like the person that's name is on the sales promotion, uh, is too busy to write that. You know, they're too busy coming up with marketing ideas. and and you write something, I write something. You can put my letter into AI and ask it if a human wrote it, it'll tell you yes. It's really fun to do that stuff. And you know, you read it, you read it, and you read it, you read it. It's obviously me. You know, you can put 20 newsletters of mine together into chat GPT and ask it to find patterns and it'll do that for you. It's very interesting stuff. And as we move into this machine coded world, like I have kids, so what I'm teaching my kids right now, it's a couple things. Number one, I make them play lots of tennis because it's a very good sport for their brain. Lots of chess, no television. And when it comes to school, I'm pushing them into humanities. And people are really like put off by this because humanities when when I was coming along were not really something that, you know, you thought to go study. But I'm trying to explain to them that understanding how the human mind approaches human life is going to be more important than ever. And that's what I want them to understand. All these things I'm mentioning are logic, reason, how to frame different, you know, concepts and ideas as it relates to our journey as humans. And I think that that's going to be the thing that's so important in the next cycle. And I think everybody's missing this. I mean, it's really kind of shocking to watch what they push their kids to do. If you're looking for a simple, secure way to invest and own physical gold and silver, visit our sister company, Hardass Assets Alliance at hardassetsalliance.com. That's hardassallalliance.com. >> Demonstrating that I have read your stuff, I picked uh sort of three phrases that uh I'd love you to give us uh you know a prey of your thinking about. The first one is capitalism is dead. That one people have a hard time with. But the thing is, it really is debt. I mean, capitalism was about capital. So, you worked hard. You spent less money than you earned. You saved up the difference. You used that to seed businesses or loan money to people. The bank was a key component of that. And all that is debt. I mean, we can go through those one by one. Number one, the bank is dead. I mean, going to the bank, I was at the bank today. Had to go to the bank today. and uh you go to the bank and it's like worse than going to the county to pay, you know, like a permit fee or something like that. It's really bad. And they think you're a terrorist and they, you know, they won't give you any. It's just crazy. The whole thing is crazy. And you can see that banking is on the way out. We all know this. You know, the $100 bill is your biggest bill. I mean, I'm live up in New York City half the time and like that's like a coffee date, you know, for 100 bucks and nobody wants the cash. I mean, so we know that part's dead. then you don't really borrow at the bank anymore. You know, you're a lot of times you're doing some sort of alternative lending thing. You're not really going over to the bank to do much. So, you have to really wonder what these banks are doing. And then you get into the market side of things and like the the dumbest, you know, idea for buying stocks is like value investing for example, right? I mean, like you read this value investing stuff and it's like fun to read because it's like hokey. It's kind of like a story from the 1950s, but it doesn't work. It's not going to work again. And we're out of that. we're just out of that. And what what you start to see when you dig into this trade is that we sort of left capitalism behind because after the conflict with, you know, the Soviets wrapped up, after kind of like this half ccentury cold war narrative sort of wound down, some smart people in the west realize we really can't tolerate recessions. I mean, it's it's too difficult because, you know, there's three tire stores and one of them, the guy has bought jet skis and, you know, been been like, you know, risky with his money. He's going to go out of business in a recession and that guy's going to like go crazy, you know, and the worst thing that might happen is he might like find discipline and then become like, you know, serious after the recession, which is even worse because then he'll like question everything. So, we got to like sort of like zombify these people by having like a perma boom. And so we we went into this it didn't it didn't work flawlessly because obviously like we tried to do it with housing in the beginning and people got sort of out of control. Humans human incentive took over you know and like exotic dancers were buying like 10 condos and stuff before they were built. So that's always going to happen you know and so you start seeing you're like we we're not in a free market system and we don't have recessions. We have all these people are calling for this and that's happening but like face the facts. You have, you know, a long stock rally and then you have a 3-w week absolute panic and everybody in the market sees that like somebody tinkers with the index, you know, futures and, you know, the the the the market has to like trade around that and sort of like turns things back up and then you have a bunch of old people arguing about PE ratios and stuff and it just doesn't matter. It's like it's all hype and narrative and and and options and futures and derivative trading and that's a lot for people. I'm not going to blame you if you leave a nasty comment, but I think slowly in time you're going to see that telling your kid to do a lemonade stand is really really bad advice. What you should tell your kid is learn how everything works and then come up with the biggest biggest wildest idea possible that has unlimited blue sky and looks impossible and then sell that idea >> and people will just give you as much money as necessary. The last thing you want to do is to run a lemonade stand and make 15% profit that's worth about nothing and you're going to have to work there all the time. But you come up with a humongous idea and you there's got unlimited access to capital. And I think once you see it from that perspective, you'll realize that that was not possible during capitalism. I mean, if you walked in to to to like, you know, AG Edwards or something or, you know, like Smith Barney back in the day and you're like, I got this idea for flying vertical taxis. They'd be like, get out of here. It's like they be like, we got an asylum for you. You know, so so nowadays it's like if you walk in and say I got a lemonade stand, it makes 15% profit. They're like, "No one cares about that." So, so the whole way we grew up thinking about this is dead. >> A little bit of Lucy in the five cents for psychological help if you remember. >> Sure. >> From right. >> So, the second phrase that was excellent is blackout shock. What do you mean by that? >> Wait, which one is this? When was this the last the last uh >> blackout? knockout sort of yeah the beginning of last year. >> Oh well I mean I mean I I I I that one we're kind of going you know back in time but I mean I I think um you know you you find these times where like it's very difficult to sort of take the the the old way of looking at things and and and make sense of of uh of what's going on you know now. And um you know we struggle for that. We clamor for that. I think where most people end up getting bamboozled is that they sort of like panic on the lows and feel confident on the highs and you know this is just like this happens so quickly now that you know we used to talk about this thing called dizzybat where it was like you spin around with your head on a bat and then get up and try to walk across the room. I mean, this is and if you're like 20 years old, this is a great drinking game, by the way. But like you you know, it's you're disoriented. You know, you can't walk. You don't know what's going on. And so, I think, you know, nowadays what we're seeing is is is like that gets people. It got people in April. You know, it gets it gets people, you know, in the summer lows. It's like, you know, it's like the fear, the the the disorientation. Like, it's very difficult for people to do. They're looking for an explanation, but the explanation's already been given to them, but they can't understand it, you know, because it's too it's too new. And I just think we never faced anything like that, you know, back in the day. We learned about the depression, all this stuff, you know, we don't have that anymore. We have these like sheer panic events, you know, these these sort of like, you know, just where you you're totally disoriented for a short period of time. >> And the third phrase is price of hope. That one's my favorite because because that one has turned into like a whole odyssey. I mean, I was >> some of the stuff that I was making fun of in the beginning when we did that I ended up thinking actually might go up in value more, you know, because because what will people pay for unlimited upside? >> I mean, it's like Amazon before it made a profit was worth a lot more. and you start realizing that that people just want hope. I mean, there's no other explanation as to why people go play the Powerball. I mean, everybody that wins the Powerball ends up either incarcerated or dead. So, I mean, there's a really good reason to not play the Powerball. Then you got like, you know, odds that just, you make Vancouver speculators cringe. And, you know, people line up to play it, right? And it's like, why do they do that? Because there's something about having that ticket in your pocket and just saying, "Well, what would we do if this happened?" And and you know what people do, Trey, that's crazy is they don't do things they could do right now. They don't do that. You know, they do they they have this kind of like they they live in this hope. They they they just love it. And so what I'm trying to say to people is instead of the price of earnings, you know, like the lemonade stand is worth five times its its earning power, but the hope is worth a thousand times its earning power because nobody can do the math on it because there is no math to do. I mean, we're talking we had a stock in the newsletter uh that we got into at 20 bucks. It ran up to like 60. No product, no revenue. I mean, they had to go through a process to get the product certified. They hadn't even done that yet. So, when when can we see the prototype? No prototype, only a rendering. And this thing went to 60 bucks, then it came down in April and it went to like 195 or something. So, I mean, you're talking like, you know, the the bottom to top was like 20 to almost 200. So, I mean, you almost went 10x with no product. So, I mean, if you were doing the math on that, like the accountants can't even do the math because there's no math to do, you know? It's only like how much are they going to spend? And the answer was like a huge amount. And everybody's like, "That's a problem." But it's not a problem because the stock's going to 200. They would just sell like $500 million worth of Treasury stock and put out a press release and then the market would go down for like two days. It would go back up because people would be like, "I got to get more of that thing. I didn't buy enough." And so that's when people see that, you know, I think it changes their So what you want to do is like what the Tucker letter is doing. We run this trustee portfolio. So it's actually the real portfolio for a trust where I'm the manager. I'm the trustee. So like for now, I could be fired, but like I've done a pretty good job, you know, and I haven't done any like massive hit the ball out of the park stuff. We just kind of like chug along ahead of the market, which is everybody, you know, the the people that monitor it are happy with that. And so what you see is like you you got to think about like what's going to be this thing that people are going to be talking about next year. What's going to be the thing they're talking about? And like you know I I just personally you know I think the institutions are going to be talking more about Bitcoin but we don't have to get into that. But I think the average person is going to be talking about vertical electric flying taxis. I mean, I I don't know if you saw, but in the Wall Street Journal, you know, Steven Ross, you know, the related group, Billionaire Runs Related Group, was like, "The only way to get from Miami to Palm Beach is going to be flying vertical electric taxi." >> And there's a picture of one of the companies, I'm not going to say which one because it's not fair to my readers, but I just got back from being at that company's booth. I mean, there was two companies that I, you know, spent time with at this air show, but they had the same picture right where I was. And I was like, "Yeah, I mean, he's right." Like, like what's going to happen is you're going to have these planes that that that go to the ground. They're they're battery powered. When they pick people up, they're going to take like a 10% charge, you know, the same way your iPhone gets charged on the docking station. Then it's going to go up. It's going to fly horizontal to the destination like 100 100 miles away and it's going to go down and it's going to take four more passengers and you know take the power through the wings like your iPhone does and it's going to do that all day long and it's quiet and you're just going to have these things everywhere and they're going to be like you know $200 or $300 a seat depending on where you're going to go and you're going to book that from the Uber app or from the Lyft app or from the Delta app or whatever and you're going to you're going to take this and you're going to take it from like San Diego to LA. You're going to take it from like, you know, New York out to the Hamptons. And people are like, I showed it to this guy that that runs this really good coffee shop. He's actually like one really cool dude. And he he goes, "Nuh-uh, no, no way, man." And and I was like, "Yeah, here's a video of the thing." So that's the reaction that you want, right? I mean, that's the thing that you want to say to people, like, you know, that's how you know that that guy definitely hasn't bought the stock yet, right? Like You got to think about like, you know, in the 90s this guy told me I was like, "Why does stocks go up?" You know, I was like in my 20s. I was like, "Why do stocks go?" He goes, "More buyers than sellers." So like that's really the at the end of the day it's like you need to find something that doesn't have, you know, everybody's already bought that. I mean, it's not that that can't go up, but like if everybody owns it, everybody believes in it. I mean, that's that's like, you know, the room's pretty full, right? So, you want to find something that's pretty obvious and that is happening that people say, "Nuhuh. No way, man." And that's that's how you know that their Robin Hood app does not have shares of that. >> So, uh, backing up a little bit back to your newsletter, would you say it's more about investment advice or is it more about sort of life lifestyle and psychological well-being? >> Here's the thing. The I I would love to not mention any stocks at all in there. I mean, the thing is is that is that, you know, I really what I want to talk about is the things that I want to talk to my kids about, the stories that I'm telling them, the the things that I've done, the things I'm learning about. And what I've done for 25 years is I've been professionally learning. And that's what I always wanted to do. You know, I wanted to do that since I was eight years old. I was telling someone the other day that my dad taught me about like the Contra scandal or something when I was like eight years, seven or eight years old. And I was like, uhhuh. I'm listening to all this and I'm like looking at my atlas being like where are all these places you know and I was just like completely curious and I don't really tend to get into stuff ideologically. I mean I'm not registered to vote. Um you know I don't care about a lot of things people care about at all and I'm very interested in them. So I'll sit down and they'll tell me all about it. I'm fascinated but I don't really care to do anything about it. But I'm always learning. And so the thing is is that the writing is is is my way of synthesizing how I see what I've learned against what's happening. Because the inevitable outcome of me learning this stuff is I'll be like this makes no sense. Like you I'm looking at what people are doing and I'm looking at this thing I've learned and the two things they don't they clash. And what I've learned over the last 25 years is that is that that means it's just early. And that was like the gold book, you know. It was like the gold book wasn't about like buy gold. It was like it was about why gold. It was like it was like, you know, it wasn't buy gold, buy it now. It was why gold, why now? You know, and and and you know, from reading it that like I talked about a company that I was on the board of. I'm not on the board of that company anymore. Haven't been since, you know, 2023. But the this it's like a, you know, few pages. If I could write the book again, I would just take that out because that, you know, has been a disappointing circumstance. But the thing is is that is that the book is about my journey through the gold business, you know, and when you pay $20 for a book and it synthesizes like the entire story of gold and one guy's, you know, quest to like figure it all out, that's a lot of entertainment and you learn a lot of stuff and that stuff can massively change the next decade of your life. And so the newsletter is like that every single issue. It's 26 times a year and you're you're doing things with me that you're not going to do yourself. and you're doing things that you might then take your family and go do and that's like a special relationship, you know. So, so the way I hope people see it is that you're walking along with me. You're walking with me for a long time. And this is not going to be a big business. I mean, the problem with some of these people that I mentioned earlier that I work for is their businesses got really big. And the Tucker letter is going to be stubbornly small. It's not going to be big. We don't do marketing. There's no banner ads. We let you quit anytime you want. You want to read for free, you can read half the issue for free. You want to cancel your subscription, you can cancel it. But let me tell you this. This is what people don't understand. If you subscribe, we lock your pricing in forever. As long as you stay subscribed, we never raise the price. The price goes up every year, but but once you're subscribed, you're in forever. So, you know, we have these people that want to cancel and we're like, "No problem." But you do realize that like, you know, you you started reading this thing early and I mean, like, you know, the price is like going up quite a bit. is going to keep going up. So, because we're not going to get big, we're just going to raise the price as we get higher so that less people come. We want a certain amount of people. And it's not because it's exclusive either. We want people to read. That's what we want. We want people to read. It's a lot of pressure, Trey, to write this thing. You know, because you write, right? >> But it's a lot of pressure. I mean, the last issue that I wrote is like an incredible issue. I mean, like >> you got to write. It's a lot of text. It's like 120,000 words a year, man. That's a lot, you know? Maybe it's more, maybe 130. So, so come enjoy that. That's the deal. And when you don't enjoy it anymore, you can just leave and you know, you can come back whenever you want and we'll, you know, we'll charge you more because the price will have gone up. But >> this is a different way of doing things. Most of what people see is stock guru has something to change your life. Click here and pay $3,000 and be disappointed. And that's just a bad way to do business. I I don't know. It's actually it's a good way if you want to make a lot of money. It's a bad way if you're naturally a storyteller because you don't get the chance to do that because you blow everybody up. >> As I'm sure you uh have heard, our bent uh here at what I do at Wealthon is definitely in the precious metal sector. And just spending some time on that before we let you go. The uh you mentioned in one of the things that I watched that you originally bought silver because you thought it was cool. What what did you mean by that and do you still think it's cool? >> Uh mixed feelings. I mean the first time I bought some I bought a monster box. I think the price was like $7 an ounce or something like that. And um I just thought that was a lot of coins and I was like this is like so many coins. I just think I felt like like it was historic. It was like it just kind of like really struck me, you know? It was like and I I had I had an ounce or two of gold, too. It wasn't like I didn't have any gold. Um so I bought another monster box, you know, and then I started buying blocks of it, you know, like those big blocks and stuff. on your desk the last time I saw you. >> Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. I I think I had like 2,000. I I That's back in like a storage vault now. But um because you can't keep that stuff around, you know, it's too takes up too much space. You got to rent a storage. That's the thing. You got to rent a space for it. I mean, it's like an armed vault for it. >> So, I I I think the answer is is that I really do not think it's cool anymore because um maybe my life has changed. You know, I just think that like when you have a pallet of the stuff, it's like it starts to become a burden. And and and you know, the gold the amount of space the gold takes up is infinitely smaller. I mean, you can at the storage, you know, private storage place, they'll rent you like a little drawer to put the gold in. And it's better than renting like pallet space for the silver. And I just think, you know, if people are new to this, like try to not be so binary with your thinking, like it's okay to buy something because you think it's fun, you know, like to buy yourself a block of silver, a tube of coins, you know, an old gold coin because you think it's cool. You can you can geek out is what the young people call this. You can geek out on these investments and you're going to learn something and they're they they've gone up in value. But I think the trouble is when you become like a silver bug or a gold bug or an anything bug or a crypto bug, it's really dangerous because what happens is you can't see anything else. It's all you can see and you just ignore everything that doesn't agree with you. >> And so, you know, for me, I I still have all the silver. Um, it's not performed as well as shares of the Triple Q would have. Not that we're going to compare apples to apples there, but I'm just saying that like there hasn't been a monetary reward >> that's matched the overall market. However, it does look like it's going to 100. The reason I say that is because I am intimately familiar with how the market works and it does not look like it's having a good time right now. So like so it probably is going to go up a little bit more and you have to ask yourself why are people so excited because if it goes to 100 that's that's you know like what 60% rise from here. >> Mhm. >> I mean it's not that much. So uh when you look at precious metals, I always call the fundamentals the big three uh anti-doll sentiment, you know, to deteriorating US finances and eroding Fed credibility. Do you >> spend a lot of time on underlying fundamentals? >> Zero. Zero. I think to me to me that all goes out the window once you spend some time you know in the money hubs like >> you know central Europe and um I was just in UAE. I mean you start your your perspective really changes and you realize that like we're going to digitize the whole thing. >> The whole thing is going to be digital trade. If I come up there and buy you a coffee they're going to know exactly who paid and you know where we enjoyed it and everything. and I had four cups and that's too many and you know it's going to be you know terrible. But um so you start saying to yourself that's really the reason to have some is not to evade that either by the way. What I'm saying is like I look at everything as if a relative came to me and said I got this million dollars and what should I do? >> And the answer is let's let's we're going to make a pie chart. We can make it with crayons if we don't have a computer. And you know, we're gonna we're going to put a little bit of it in these different things. That's what we're going to do because our goal is to is to sort of like keep you well off. That's our goal. >> And once you see it like that and you realize that, you know, there's a reason why wealthy people and other outside of the US, you know, are like have significantly overpositioned in gold compared to the average US person. >> Yeah. this dollar thing. It's like, who really cares? I mean, you're going to have stable coins, you're going to have Fedcoin, you're going to have a new Fed. It's not going to be the same Fed. They're going to allow the Fed to kind of collapse under the weight of like press and, you know, yeah, finally, let's really look into this thing, you know, and it's like it's a hundred years too late, right? And so, you know, it goes away and then a new bigger, stronger, safer Fed comes and, you know, it includes all the stable coins and that's where all the money's moving right now anyway. and it's, you know, more equipped to control you and you'll be thinking, boy, that old Fed wasn't so bad. Uh, so that's how I look at the dollar. I'm just like, it doesn't really matter. I mean, sort of like you need it to function. You really need it to function. I mean, who's really storing physical dollars, you know? It's not that many people. I mean, like like housewives, you know, in overseas maybe are storing some dollars, but that's fine. I mean, it's not really my position. But like, you know, will the dollar go why would the dollar go up? I mean, why would it not go down? I mean, that's the better question. It's like, why do these people It always blows my mind that the average, you know, middle class American is just like beside themselves that the dollar wouldn't go up. It's like, well, who's who's doing you any favors? I mean, like I have a cousin that's a congressman. Like, you know, he ain't doing me any favors. You know, I'm asking you for favors. You know what I mean? It's like it's like nobody's going to help you, right? Like, nobody's Come on, get out of here. Like, you've lost your mind. The thing is is that you they want it to be a controlled decline. That's the deal. It needs to be a graceful decline. And uh so once you see that becomes a little easier, you know, it's not anybody's job and you don't have to go buy 100% gold. But I think if you go back to my book and you you know, you had a small percentage of gold, you're pretty happy about that. >> You're happy about that. >> Commenting early uh you I think you were in Morocco at the time. there was a pool behind you and you were talking about how gold stocks were probably not worth, you know, the trouble. Um, and not that I disagree with you, they're a very uh complicated business with a lot of impediments and certainly over long periods since 2000, there have been periods where a lot of capital's been malinvested, etc. But since you were talking in early 2025, they've obviously done pretty well. I think the GDX is up like 160%. Do you still >> Do you still >> I think Yeah, I mean GDXJ is 144. Uh I mean I've got them all over here. You know, this is this is all these different screens. I mean the thing that that that to me is is stunning is the gold price is up this year 60%. And if you win around Denver gold show or something, one of these like, you know, poorly attended shows, and you're like, the gold price is going to be up 60%, it's going to be $4,200 an ounce. It's going to be sustained there, you know, like not like a day. What's your stock price? >> All of them would have told you 10x. >> Mhm. >> They would have all told you 10x. And some of them, you know, in this list are up, you know, 150% and, you know, 70% and 200%. I mean, they're not all up, you know, tremendous, but they didn't they didn't really do anything for about 10 years, you know. So, it's like except issue stock and pay themselves a lot, >> right? That was >> I just don't >> what I don't understand is the enthusiasm. And I think you need to understand also that I've been on boards in the industry. I've resigned from boards in the industry. I'll say that one more time. I resigned from boards in the industry. What does that tell you? >> Um, and not because of like a bad disagreement because like I just don't get it. I mean, I'm like there your story is operating leverage to a rising metal price, but the metal price has been rising a lot. I mean, I know because I wrote a book about it. Mhm. >> And your stock is Yeah. I mean, it's going up. It better be going up, >> right? >> Like, >> so we'll we'll we'll leave the the gold question for a minute. And I just think uh I'd ask you uh you know, what do you see from other than buying your letter, which I would encourage everyone to look at because it sounds fascinating. What do you see coming in 2026? And how should people be preparing for these challenges? Well, I don't want I don't want to tell everything because we're going to we're going to talk about this in the newsletter. I want to be fair to people, but I think there's going to be one sector, one innovative sector that's going to surprise everybody next year. I think it's going to attract a lot of capital. >> I think it's I think there's so much money in the Western world, it's unbelievable. And people have a hard time with that because they say, "Well, I need some of that money." Well, it's like you need a bigger idea >> because if you notice when you have a big idea, you've got people shoveling money at the idea. So, I think there's one industry that we're we're going to be talking about in the next issue that >> we're we have three stocks. First of all, there's a founder letter as well with the with the newsletter. >> We talked about a stock in there in this industry that's like, you know, very small market cap. You know, that's a small that's kind of like a next level of the newsletter. we don't really have a portfolio in there, but sometimes I'll learn something that's like not really meant for the full audience. It's too it's just too dangerous. But um I was taking some extra time to explain to the founders, you know, it's there's like a quarterly note to the founders that this is what's interesting to me is that you see this industry that's cracking out of its eggshell and there's all these little companies around that are going to float up with it and it's some of them will fail, some of them will go up 10 times and then they'll fail, but doesn't really matter. It's like this is what happens when you catch a trend. It's kind of like the gold business, you know, it never really regained its 70s glory, >> you know, like most of the people were kind of looking for that again. When it ran in 2000, most of the people making that run were people from the 70s that were now retired. It never really hit. The story never caught on. You know, there's no young person that's like, I want to own a gold miner. There's just like a couple thousand angry people in Vancouver that want to own gold miners. But, you know, my point is you want a giant audience >> for a story. there's millions of people and they look at something and they go, "Wow, that's cool and I want to buy it." Uh, okay. So, that's one thing. Second thing is I think Bitcoin is going to surprise people because there's so much negativity. It's unbelievable. I mean, I'll even in this video right now there'll be 50 uh juvenile comments in the bottom about this statement, but I bet you next year when you look back, I mean, Bitcoin's flat for the year. I think people kind of forget that it's flat for the year. And um 1.8 trillion market cap is pretty small when you compare that to you know the treasury issuance the the equity market the value of real estate value of gold 1.8 trillion is it 1 yeah 1.82 82 trillion. It's pretty small. And I think that, you know, in time the rest of the blockchain will get solved by quantum computing power. So that'll be done. And I think it'll become sort of a sought after, you know, thing people people want. And um I think it's a little crazy if you're somewhat young not to have a little tiny, you know, garnish of of Bitcoin. And I don't think that's the same for all the other coins to be honest with you. I don't really buy into it. Um, and I think a tiny tiny amount will do. You know, I don't think it's like with gold. You know, you didn't need to be 20% gold. >> Could have been 3% gold >> and it tripled. So now you're 10% gold, which is like really plenty, you know, because I mean, you know, it's like you're picture yourself as like your own central bank. >> You know, you don't really need that much gold, you know? It's not really like something that you're not running a gold company. you know, you're running your life. You're trying to live here, man. Because the the thing nobody tells you, Trey, is you're gonna die at some point. >> So, you gotta live, man. And um you know, you want to flow down the river of life. I mean, if you're you know, you're clinging to the edge, you're not you're not enjoying the ride. And so, uh that's that's two things that we're going to be talking about between now and the end of the year. I hope people will read. >> Excellent. Well, listen, Eie, thanks very much for your time. Uh good luck on your trip to New York. take those coats. Maybe play a little indoor tennis on 59th Street when you're there. >> Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. That's that's Sutton. Uh >> yeah, that's where I used >> the Sen bubble under the Cotch Bridge. Yeah. >> Terrific. Well, thanks for your time. Really appreciate it. Fascinating. And we if you're uh up for it, we'll check in with you in six months or so and see how you're doing. >> Sounds good. Look forward to it. >> Terrific. Thanks. Don't forget to sign up for a free portfolio review with one of our endorsed investment partners at wealthon.comfree. With markets hitting all-time highs, now is a great time to stress test your strategy and be prepared for what comes next. Thank you all for watching. We'll see you again next time.
E.B. Tucker: How the Investors Who Win Actually Think | Your Beliefs May Be Costing You Money
Summary
Transcript
You've got two types of people, you know, one type of person brings their idea of how things ought to be into the market and then the other type of person walks in and says, "What's going on here?" And, you know, then figures out, "What should we do about it?" And the second person in that equation tends to make a lot more money. Don't forget to sign up for a free portfolio review with one of our endorsed investment partners at wealthon.comfree. >> Well, greetings and welcome to our wealthy show. My name is Trey Reich and I'm here today with EB Tucker, the I would say freewheeling freeth thinker uh who is the editor of the fascinating publication the Tucker Letter. Uh I'm 65 years old. I'm a career institutional investor and I've spent the past quarter century investing in precious metals and all I can say is I really wish I had encountered your philosophy, way of thinking and spiritual code a bit earlier in my life because it might have helped me traverse the highs and lows of precious metal investings uh over the last quarter century. So I've really enjoyed uh getting to know your work. Thanks for being with us today. >> Thanks for having me and thanks for the generous introduction. And all I'll say back to you is is that it's never too late. It's it's it's only you know it's relative, right? Like too late >> too late for uh one person is is too soon for another. >> Very good advice. Um, so, uh, again, I I'm a little out of sorts in, uh, I actually spent more time looking at your stuff, researching what you've done than I think I have for any other guest ever because it's so fascinating and it's so broad. Um, but if I were to try to reduce what I've learned over the last couple of days, I'd summarize your investment philosophy as don't fight it. Be flexible. pay attention to what's going on. Uh, is that fair? >> Sure. I mean, I I I I I love when you say you're out of sorts because I tal I gave a speech at a conference last year, institutional conference, and the first person that raised their hand said, "Are you on mushrooms?" And and I I I actually I said, you know, I don't take any mood and mindaltering substances. and not for any moral reason whatsoever, but I just like at one point had to decide that I was going to just ride the wave, you know, totally natural and it was just what I did. But I thought it was like the best question ever. So when you said you were out of sorts, I was I was thinking you were going to say, "Is this guy on drugs?" But the answer is I'm not on drugs. Um I I think what's happened is I figured out at some point that you've got two types of people. You know, one type of person brings their idea of how things ought to be into the market. And then the other type of person walks in and says, "What's going on here?" And, you know, then figures out, "What should we do about it?" And the second person in that equation tends to make a lot more money. And then people say, "Well, you're just about money." And it's like, I I got to tell you, money doesn't fix problems. And um what's weird about money, too, is that sometimes it's a curse. Like you see some of these people and they just make this shrine to these money ideas and they it just kills them. >> And so what has occurred to me and I wrote this in my second book you I wrote a lot about this topic in my second book not for sale which I don't think really anyone read but basically the the the point is is that the money just doesn't matter. I mean if you can get your head right about how you're going to think about investment decisions you're going to do fine. like you're gonna make enough money, you're gonna do fine. You're gonna you might have to work a little bit, you know? I mean, everybody's always like thinks that I'm really rich. And I'm like, well, what is really rich? I mean, I know some people that are that are like really really rich and like they haven't driven themselves in 20 years and and they've got a lot of problems sometimes. And then sometimes I know people that that that aren't rich enough, you know, they should probably be at work, you know, and then there's like a huge spectrum in between, you know, and it's like quit worrying about what's rich and what's not rich and there's not like an investment or a trade that's going to change your life because when you walk into the market and you say, you know, I need it to change my life, like you're you're going to get really hurt. I mean, that's not what the market does, you know. And I think as soon as you start thinking about this stuff and stop leaving nasty comments that you, you know, you want a stock tip and anybody that doesn't give it to you is just like gets pie in the face, you're going to make lots of money. I mean, like, because that's when you see Trey, that's when you see what's really going on. And once you see what's going on, you can't unsee it. That's the thing is that you're like, "Oh, now I get it." You know, and then once you get it, it just looks easy. >> It really looks easy. I mean know like we're generating returns right now that when I was a kid I used to watch Lewis Rookheiser's Wall Street which you probably remember I thought he was the coolest guy and mostly because of his his outfits you know he wore those like like really you know big three-piece suits or whatever but I remember if you had told that guy you would have stocks in the Tucker letter portfolio we have a stock uh like kind of a picks and shovels AI thing that's up like I don't know 40% or something since like you know September and you're just like get out of here man. I mean that's like imagine that you know going back to like the days when we were investing like capitalists and we were kind of counting on companies to like you know grow the business and manage the debt properly and like build shareholder equity and then we say yeah we made 40% since September and it's not enough. Can you imagine? I mean like it's crazy. And so I think I think when you can like zoom out and kind of like see this for what it is, it starts to get much easier. >> So I think uh one way that I might rephrase what you just said to make sure I'm getting the theme is f you mentioned repeatedly that people are too focused on trying to hit the ultimate home run and in doing so they're distracted uh by seeing the forest through the trees. Is that fair? >> Pretty much. I mean, the thing is, I've hit a couple of really intense home runs, and not one of them did I get, you know, wake up thinking I'm going to go hit a home run on this. Most of the home runs that I hit that were like the 100x things, I thought, this is really dumb and I'm going to and I'm going to invest an amount of money that doesn't make me feel really dumb when it doesn't work out. And then it just went like kaboom. But that's what I'm trying to say to people is like you got to get your head right about what you're doing. and and and once you do, you're going to see how this thing works and then it's just going to be one after another. I mean, if you read the newsletter, it's like a marathon. It's like it's not a sprint, you know, and it's like people have a lot of preconceived notions, but it's like we've been doing this for a long time and uh I've done a couple different things in my career and you know, writing newsletters has been my favorite thing to do. And I mean, you can like find, you know, archives going way way back and it's like we got to play the cycles as they come up. I mean, I want to slide into like one thing that's related to this because sometimes, as you know, from catching up on the recent issues. I'll kind of give people like a little bit of an algebra equation of like what's I'm kind of like when I was a kid, my dad was like, you really got to learn algebra, which made no sense to me. And he was like, once you see the equation, then everything starts to kind of like fit into equations and you're just going to realize that like this is very helpful stuff. And I just thought that was crazy. But now I'm like, man, he really knew what he was talking about, right? So, one of the things that I do this time of year, and I don't want to spoil the next newsletter, but I've talked about this a little bit. It's like I look around at the universe of things you can invest in, it's like, what is everything worth? You know, I I'm really bothered sort of by like the gold you I I was in the gold business for a little while and sort of involved in some companies. I'm I'm not really involved in that at all. I haven't been for some time. And one of the things I don't understand is that people are like pounding the table for for much higher gold prices. And it's like gold's worth $30 trillion. I mean that that's like that number could be off by a little bit but that's like a pretty close number you know if you go by all the world gold numbers of what's in the ground whatever but $30 trillion well the stock market's worth 72 trillion okay so and then the the global that's the US the global stock market I'd say is another 50 trillion or something and then the US housing market is like 55 trillion which I think is a little high because like US housing is like really stuck and I I would challenge anyone you know to to to to prove me wrong on this but What I'm seeing is a lot of people waiting for rates to come down, waiting for a catalyst where so 55 trillion is generous and then the treasury's got 38 trillion and then Bitcoin's worth like 1.8 trillion. And so I watch these guys talk about like gold's going to 10,000 and I'm just like maybe I mean I mean probably someday, right? But like what is the like the silver people like what is the point in holding out for 15 years for a double? I mean, what is actually we we're talking about there's stocks in the Tucker letter portfolio went up like 40% in seven or eight weeks. I mean, like, and that's like an accident, right? I mean, that's like a large company going up. It's like, whoa. Okay, that that that gets our attention. But what is the point of like holding out for that? And then double what is the point if you look at gold and you're like, you know, it's 30 trillion. Is it going to go to like, you know, 80 trillion or something? Is it going to be worth more than all the stocks? I mean, I don't really understand people's negativity about stocks. And it doesn't mean that I'm like all bowled up on stocks. What I'm saying is that like the average American really likes to think about a crash. And it's like, okay, I mean, you have this scenario where the stock market is like our checkbook, you know, for like, you know, businesses and for people and everything, right? like like the they've made it they're giving infants they're giving infants stock accounts so that pe they can they can they can like you know make everybody equal. You've read about this I'm sure. So you really think this is going to crash? Well, what is it going to crash? Is it going to fall in half? Well, if it fell in half then it would be worth what gold's worth. >> And and and and you know nobody likes gold more than me, right? But like the the reality is is that like the opportunistic time to buy gold was when I wrote the book about gold. I mean, that was like, you know, like nearly tripled now. And it's like everybody I'm just like, what are people pounding the table about? You know, I think like you need to own some gold. You don't really need that much gold. And you need to probably need to own some Bitcoin. And nobody wants to do that right now. And we've been writing in the newsletter that all these like token bros, you know, that are renting Lamborghinis and buying like, you know, like obscure 13,000 different obscure tokens probably aren't going to be the ones that come out on top of this. It's probably going to be the people that say, "You know what I'm going to do? I'm going to probably take like a 5% allocation to Bitcoin and I'm just going to just do nothing with it." I mean, I said that like if you did that with gold, I mean, you know this because you've been around for a while. Like if you did that with gold and it was like 500, 600, 800,000, 1,200, 1500, you're just like, "Let me just take like a 5% allocation." You killed it. >> You killed it. And then your stock investing got better because your portfolio was like more stable. It It didn't have like whiplash all the time. And so what I'm the reason I'm putting that all out there to you is not to say buy Bitcoin. I actually don't think it's totally essential to buy Bitcoin. What I'm saying is that I listen to people, Trey. I listen to what they say and then I'm like, what are they even talking about? I mean, like let's look at the value of everything, you know? Like I don't think anybody does that, you know? And it's like it's like Bitcoin's like a like a like a a early teenager, >> right? you know, and the people involved. I mean, like they're they're just going to get like some of these people are leverage, going to get washed out. What does that tell you? That tells you that like there's some people that have a hundred million bucks are like, you know, my kids been telling me about this for 10 years. I should probably buy like a million dollars worth of I mean, this is like serious money becoming involved. And then people talk about like the rug coming out from under it. I'm just like maybe maybe but I mean I mean I I think having 5% exposure and being subject to the rug coming off under you it's two different things you know it's kind of like you know if they figure out how to from space find all the gold in the ground which I think they're going to be able to do at some point the value of gold would go down right because it would be like oh we discovered this pile of it over here and like the supply went up. Do you get what I'm saying? I mean, this happened with oil, remember? It's like we're going to run out of oil, then we, you know, commercialize shell production and the oil's $58 a barrel and like you're swimming in the stuff. Anyway, my point is is that like if you want to really succeed, I mean, if you want to like if you want to really be rich, the way to do it is to run a marathon. And on a marathon, you just you just outpace everybody, man. They just drop dead like like slowly year after year. people swing for the fences and they burn out their cash and they do like crazy things and you just don't have to do that. And it's and it's it's also it's not boring to do what we're talking about like to have like proper allocations to different things and to like keep up with things. How about this one? To read stuff so you can learn. How about that? Nobody does that. They're like, "Let me get a cracker jack box with a prize at the bottom. This a stock ticker. I'm not going to know when to sell it and I'm just gonna blame everybody when I don't make enough money to fix all my problems. That person is just going to get washed out at the first time it rains they're gone. And you don't want to be that person. And you know what the good news is? Is you don't have to be that person >> because it's like all you got to do I mean we're telling you what to do. You know like every issue of the Tucker letter it's like all you got to do is read and nobody wants to read anymore. They're like let me get a summary of it. It's like come on. I mean, you can ask AI to summarize it for you, but you're not going to get the full monty. You got to read. >> By the way, I still write 12, 13 page letters, so I'm very familiar with that. I have been told a million times, you should do a podcast and whenever I ask people if my if they've read my letter, they go, I skimmed it. I've heard the word skim more often than my middle name. >> Yeah. I mean, I mean, I I'm always tempted to put, you know, put a put a check in the in the margin if you're reading this right now, you know, like remember that's what we did in the 80s. We did that with our teachers. We would we would write that into the paper, you know, and then they would put like a giant X over there because we were being clowns, you know. But the thing is, people don't understand. You write because you have to write. >> That's why you write. You don't write as some kind of like stunt or something or to make money. I write a newsletter because that's what I do. I write the newsletter. I don't really care if a million people read the newsletter or a thousand people read the newsletter. I write it because I'm the writer. And and when I was reading stuff, like I remember reading Doug Casey's letter, you know, like 20 plus years ago when he would write this story about getting like lost in Cambodia somewhere and I was like mesmerized. >> I mean, I was like, this is like the best story I've ever read in my life. I wasn't reading that for a stock pick. I mean, sure, I liked things he said about like how to present as a wealthy person in the making and stuff. I like that. You know, I was interested in that. But what I really liked was getting wrapped up in a story. I thought it was a lot of fun. And, you know, then I ended up meeting him in 2009 at a lunch that he doesn't remember. And then I ended up uh working for someone else that bought his company. And so, we got back together and I worked for And so, like my point is that's called a journey. That's a marathon. That's not like one thing that you learned. I mean that that's like, you know, years of doing something fun and then when you do something fun, magic happens. And you can do that in the market, too. >> Bill Bonner, the daily reckoning. I'm sure you read that for years as well. >> I used to write Bill's monthly letter when he started a monthly there. You know, he was like, I I I can't, you know, I don't know how to do a monthly because it's like a different format. He's a daily guy, right? >> And so they put me with him and I wrote that for him. And Bill's like, you know, he's got like nine houses. First thing he tells you too is he's like a simple man. I'm like, "Built, nine houses and simplicity don't completely mix, but I'll let you go ahead and wear that hat, you know, because he's he's like the coolest guy ever, you know, but um >> he still fance a journey. >> He'sard he still favors France, >> couple places in France, big place in Argentina, you know, he's all over the place and uh and nothing's dramatic. I mean, I don't want you get the wrong idea, but I mean, you know, we would we would convene in these places and like, you know, drink coffee and, you know, walk around, do pull-ups. And so, I mean, it was just the the most fun job I ever had, you know, at the time. And uh and all those guys are just great. But the reality is is they write because they write. That's what they do, you know, and if you read for a while, you you're going to learn a lot of stuff, you know, and it's like you're going to there's a magic in in taking a walk with a writer. And that's a lot of people don't get that, you know. Then the other thing, let me just tell you one more thing about this industry that I think surprises people is a lot of the big heavily marketed newsletters, not the ones that we've been talking about, but like things that are coming out right now, they're written by like standin ghostriters. And a lot of times like the person that's name is on the sales promotion, uh, is too busy to write that. You know, they're too busy coming up with marketing ideas. and and you write something, I write something. You can put my letter into AI and ask it if a human wrote it, it'll tell you yes. It's really fun to do that stuff. And you know, you read it, you read it, and you read it, you read it. It's obviously me. You know, you can put 20 newsletters of mine together into chat GPT and ask it to find patterns and it'll do that for you. It's very interesting stuff. And as we move into this machine coded world, like I have kids, so what I'm teaching my kids right now, it's a couple things. Number one, I make them play lots of tennis because it's a very good sport for their brain. Lots of chess, no television. And when it comes to school, I'm pushing them into humanities. And people are really like put off by this because humanities when when I was coming along were not really something that, you know, you thought to go study. But I'm trying to explain to them that understanding how the human mind approaches human life is going to be more important than ever. And that's what I want them to understand. All these things I'm mentioning are logic, reason, how to frame different, you know, concepts and ideas as it relates to our journey as humans. And I think that that's going to be the thing that's so important in the next cycle. And I think everybody's missing this. I mean, it's really kind of shocking to watch what they push their kids to do. If you're looking for a simple, secure way to invest and own physical gold and silver, visit our sister company, Hardass Assets Alliance at hardassetsalliance.com. That's hardassallalliance.com. >> Demonstrating that I have read your stuff, I picked uh sort of three phrases that uh I'd love you to give us uh you know a prey of your thinking about. The first one is capitalism is dead. That one people have a hard time with. But the thing is, it really is debt. I mean, capitalism was about capital. So, you worked hard. You spent less money than you earned. You saved up the difference. You used that to seed businesses or loan money to people. The bank was a key component of that. And all that is debt. I mean, we can go through those one by one. Number one, the bank is dead. I mean, going to the bank, I was at the bank today. Had to go to the bank today. and uh you go to the bank and it's like worse than going to the county to pay, you know, like a permit fee or something like that. It's really bad. And they think you're a terrorist and they, you know, they won't give you any. It's just crazy. The whole thing is crazy. And you can see that banking is on the way out. We all know this. You know, the $100 bill is your biggest bill. I mean, I'm live up in New York City half the time and like that's like a coffee date, you know, for 100 bucks and nobody wants the cash. I mean, so we know that part's dead. then you don't really borrow at the bank anymore. You know, you're a lot of times you're doing some sort of alternative lending thing. You're not really going over to the bank to do much. So, you have to really wonder what these banks are doing. And then you get into the market side of things and like the the dumbest, you know, idea for buying stocks is like value investing for example, right? I mean, like you read this value investing stuff and it's like fun to read because it's like hokey. It's kind of like a story from the 1950s, but it doesn't work. It's not going to work again. And we're out of that. we're just out of that. And what what you start to see when you dig into this trade is that we sort of left capitalism behind because after the conflict with, you know, the Soviets wrapped up, after kind of like this half ccentury cold war narrative sort of wound down, some smart people in the west realize we really can't tolerate recessions. I mean, it's it's too difficult because, you know, there's three tire stores and one of them, the guy has bought jet skis and, you know, been been like, you know, risky with his money. He's going to go out of business in a recession and that guy's going to like go crazy, you know, and the worst thing that might happen is he might like find discipline and then become like, you know, serious after the recession, which is even worse because then he'll like question everything. So, we got to like sort of like zombify these people by having like a perma boom. And so we we went into this it didn't it didn't work flawlessly because obviously like we tried to do it with housing in the beginning and people got sort of out of control. Humans human incentive took over you know and like exotic dancers were buying like 10 condos and stuff before they were built. So that's always going to happen you know and so you start seeing you're like we we're not in a free market system and we don't have recessions. We have all these people are calling for this and that's happening but like face the facts. You have, you know, a long stock rally and then you have a 3-w week absolute panic and everybody in the market sees that like somebody tinkers with the index, you know, futures and, you know, the the the the market has to like trade around that and sort of like turns things back up and then you have a bunch of old people arguing about PE ratios and stuff and it just doesn't matter. It's like it's all hype and narrative and and and options and futures and derivative trading and that's a lot for people. I'm not going to blame you if you leave a nasty comment, but I think slowly in time you're going to see that telling your kid to do a lemonade stand is really really bad advice. What you should tell your kid is learn how everything works and then come up with the biggest biggest wildest idea possible that has unlimited blue sky and looks impossible and then sell that idea >> and people will just give you as much money as necessary. The last thing you want to do is to run a lemonade stand and make 15% profit that's worth about nothing and you're going to have to work there all the time. But you come up with a humongous idea and you there's got unlimited access to capital. And I think once you see it from that perspective, you'll realize that that was not possible during capitalism. I mean, if you walked in to to to like, you know, AG Edwards or something or, you know, like Smith Barney back in the day and you're like, I got this idea for flying vertical taxis. They'd be like, get out of here. It's like they be like, we got an asylum for you. You know, so so nowadays it's like if you walk in and say I got a lemonade stand, it makes 15% profit. They're like, "No one cares about that." So, so the whole way we grew up thinking about this is dead. >> A little bit of Lucy in the five cents for psychological help if you remember. >> Sure. >> From right. >> So, the second phrase that was excellent is blackout shock. What do you mean by that? >> Wait, which one is this? When was this the last the last uh >> blackout? knockout sort of yeah the beginning of last year. >> Oh well I mean I mean I I I I that one we're kind of going you know back in time but I mean I I think um you know you you find these times where like it's very difficult to sort of take the the the old way of looking at things and and and make sense of of uh of what's going on you know now. And um you know we struggle for that. We clamor for that. I think where most people end up getting bamboozled is that they sort of like panic on the lows and feel confident on the highs and you know this is just like this happens so quickly now that you know we used to talk about this thing called dizzybat where it was like you spin around with your head on a bat and then get up and try to walk across the room. I mean, this is and if you're like 20 years old, this is a great drinking game, by the way. But like you you know, it's you're disoriented. You know, you can't walk. You don't know what's going on. And so, I think, you know, nowadays what we're seeing is is is like that gets people. It got people in April. You know, it gets it gets people, you know, in the summer lows. It's like, you know, it's like the fear, the the the disorientation. Like, it's very difficult for people to do. They're looking for an explanation, but the explanation's already been given to them, but they can't understand it, you know, because it's too it's too new. And I just think we never faced anything like that, you know, back in the day. We learned about the depression, all this stuff, you know, we don't have that anymore. We have these like sheer panic events, you know, these these sort of like, you know, just where you you're totally disoriented for a short period of time. >> And the third phrase is price of hope. That one's my favorite because because that one has turned into like a whole odyssey. I mean, I was >> some of the stuff that I was making fun of in the beginning when we did that I ended up thinking actually might go up in value more, you know, because because what will people pay for unlimited upside? >> I mean, it's like Amazon before it made a profit was worth a lot more. and you start realizing that that people just want hope. I mean, there's no other explanation as to why people go play the Powerball. I mean, everybody that wins the Powerball ends up either incarcerated or dead. So, I mean, there's a really good reason to not play the Powerball. Then you got like, you know, odds that just, you make Vancouver speculators cringe. And, you know, people line up to play it, right? And it's like, why do they do that? Because there's something about having that ticket in your pocket and just saying, "Well, what would we do if this happened?" And and you know what people do, Trey, that's crazy is they don't do things they could do right now. They don't do that. You know, they do they they have this kind of like they they live in this hope. They they they just love it. And so what I'm trying to say to people is instead of the price of earnings, you know, like the lemonade stand is worth five times its its earning power, but the hope is worth a thousand times its earning power because nobody can do the math on it because there is no math to do. I mean, we're talking we had a stock in the newsletter uh that we got into at 20 bucks. It ran up to like 60. No product, no revenue. I mean, they had to go through a process to get the product certified. They hadn't even done that yet. So, when when can we see the prototype? No prototype, only a rendering. And this thing went to 60 bucks, then it came down in April and it went to like 195 or something. So, I mean, you're talking like, you know, the the bottom to top was like 20 to almost 200. So, I mean, you almost went 10x with no product. So, I mean, if you were doing the math on that, like the accountants can't even do the math because there's no math to do, you know? It's only like how much are they going to spend? And the answer was like a huge amount. And everybody's like, "That's a problem." But it's not a problem because the stock's going to 200. They would just sell like $500 million worth of Treasury stock and put out a press release and then the market would go down for like two days. It would go back up because people would be like, "I got to get more of that thing. I didn't buy enough." And so that's when people see that, you know, I think it changes their So what you want to do is like what the Tucker letter is doing. We run this trustee portfolio. So it's actually the real portfolio for a trust where I'm the manager. I'm the trustee. So like for now, I could be fired, but like I've done a pretty good job, you know, and I haven't done any like massive hit the ball out of the park stuff. We just kind of like chug along ahead of the market, which is everybody, you know, the the people that monitor it are happy with that. And so what you see is like you you got to think about like what's going to be this thing that people are going to be talking about next year. What's going to be the thing they're talking about? And like you know I I just personally you know I think the institutions are going to be talking more about Bitcoin but we don't have to get into that. But I think the average person is going to be talking about vertical electric flying taxis. I mean, I I don't know if you saw, but in the Wall Street Journal, you know, Steven Ross, you know, the related group, Billionaire Runs Related Group, was like, "The only way to get from Miami to Palm Beach is going to be flying vertical electric taxi." >> And there's a picture of one of the companies, I'm not going to say which one because it's not fair to my readers, but I just got back from being at that company's booth. I mean, there was two companies that I, you know, spent time with at this air show, but they had the same picture right where I was. And I was like, "Yeah, I mean, he's right." Like, like what's going to happen is you're going to have these planes that that that go to the ground. They're they're battery powered. When they pick people up, they're going to take like a 10% charge, you know, the same way your iPhone gets charged on the docking station. Then it's going to go up. It's going to fly horizontal to the destination like 100 100 miles away and it's going to go down and it's going to take four more passengers and you know take the power through the wings like your iPhone does and it's going to do that all day long and it's quiet and you're just going to have these things everywhere and they're going to be like you know $200 or $300 a seat depending on where you're going to go and you're going to book that from the Uber app or from the Lyft app or from the Delta app or whatever and you're going to you're going to take this and you're going to take it from like San Diego to LA. You're going to take it from like, you know, New York out to the Hamptons. And people are like, I showed it to this guy that that runs this really good coffee shop. He's actually like one really cool dude. And he he goes, "Nuh-uh, no, no way, man." And and I was like, "Yeah, here's a video of the thing." So that's the reaction that you want, right? I mean, that's the thing that you want to say to people, like, you know, that's how you know that that guy definitely hasn't bought the stock yet, right? Like You got to think about like, you know, in the 90s this guy told me I was like, "Why does stocks go up?" You know, I was like in my 20s. I was like, "Why do stocks go?" He goes, "More buyers than sellers." So like that's really the at the end of the day it's like you need to find something that doesn't have, you know, everybody's already bought that. I mean, it's not that that can't go up, but like if everybody owns it, everybody believes in it. I mean, that's that's like, you know, the room's pretty full, right? So, you want to find something that's pretty obvious and that is happening that people say, "Nuhuh. No way, man." And that's that's how you know that their Robin Hood app does not have shares of that. >> So, uh, backing up a little bit back to your newsletter, would you say it's more about investment advice or is it more about sort of life lifestyle and psychological well-being? >> Here's the thing. The I I would love to not mention any stocks at all in there. I mean, the thing is is that is that, you know, I really what I want to talk about is the things that I want to talk to my kids about, the stories that I'm telling them, the the things that I've done, the things I'm learning about. And what I've done for 25 years is I've been professionally learning. And that's what I always wanted to do. You know, I wanted to do that since I was eight years old. I was telling someone the other day that my dad taught me about like the Contra scandal or something when I was like eight years, seven or eight years old. And I was like, uhhuh. I'm listening to all this and I'm like looking at my atlas being like where are all these places you know and I was just like completely curious and I don't really tend to get into stuff ideologically. I mean I'm not registered to vote. Um you know I don't care about a lot of things people care about at all and I'm very interested in them. So I'll sit down and they'll tell me all about it. I'm fascinated but I don't really care to do anything about it. But I'm always learning. And so the thing is is that the writing is is is my way of synthesizing how I see what I've learned against what's happening. Because the inevitable outcome of me learning this stuff is I'll be like this makes no sense. Like you I'm looking at what people are doing and I'm looking at this thing I've learned and the two things they don't they clash. And what I've learned over the last 25 years is that is that that means it's just early. And that was like the gold book, you know. It was like the gold book wasn't about like buy gold. It was like it was about why gold. It was like it was like, you know, it wasn't buy gold, buy it now. It was why gold, why now? You know, and and and you know, from reading it that like I talked about a company that I was on the board of. I'm not on the board of that company anymore. Haven't been since, you know, 2023. But the this it's like a, you know, few pages. If I could write the book again, I would just take that out because that, you know, has been a disappointing circumstance. But the thing is is that is that the book is about my journey through the gold business, you know, and when you pay $20 for a book and it synthesizes like the entire story of gold and one guy's, you know, quest to like figure it all out, that's a lot of entertainment and you learn a lot of stuff and that stuff can massively change the next decade of your life. And so the newsletter is like that every single issue. It's 26 times a year and you're you're doing things with me that you're not going to do yourself. and you're doing things that you might then take your family and go do and that's like a special relationship, you know. So, so the way I hope people see it is that you're walking along with me. You're walking with me for a long time. And this is not going to be a big business. I mean, the problem with some of these people that I mentioned earlier that I work for is their businesses got really big. And the Tucker letter is going to be stubbornly small. It's not going to be big. We don't do marketing. There's no banner ads. We let you quit anytime you want. You want to read for free, you can read half the issue for free. You want to cancel your subscription, you can cancel it. But let me tell you this. This is what people don't understand. If you subscribe, we lock your pricing in forever. As long as you stay subscribed, we never raise the price. The price goes up every year, but but once you're subscribed, you're in forever. So, you know, we have these people that want to cancel and we're like, "No problem." But you do realize that like, you know, you you started reading this thing early and I mean, like, you know, the price is like going up quite a bit. is going to keep going up. So, because we're not going to get big, we're just going to raise the price as we get higher so that less people come. We want a certain amount of people. And it's not because it's exclusive either. We want people to read. That's what we want. We want people to read. It's a lot of pressure, Trey, to write this thing. You know, because you write, right? >> But it's a lot of pressure. I mean, the last issue that I wrote is like an incredible issue. I mean, like >> you got to write. It's a lot of text. It's like 120,000 words a year, man. That's a lot, you know? Maybe it's more, maybe 130. So, so come enjoy that. That's the deal. And when you don't enjoy it anymore, you can just leave and you know, you can come back whenever you want and we'll, you know, we'll charge you more because the price will have gone up. But >> this is a different way of doing things. Most of what people see is stock guru has something to change your life. Click here and pay $3,000 and be disappointed. And that's just a bad way to do business. I I don't know. It's actually it's a good way if you want to make a lot of money. It's a bad way if you're naturally a storyteller because you don't get the chance to do that because you blow everybody up. >> As I'm sure you uh have heard, our bent uh here at what I do at Wealthon is definitely in the precious metal sector. And just spending some time on that before we let you go. The uh you mentioned in one of the things that I watched that you originally bought silver because you thought it was cool. What what did you mean by that and do you still think it's cool? >> Uh mixed feelings. I mean the first time I bought some I bought a monster box. I think the price was like $7 an ounce or something like that. And um I just thought that was a lot of coins and I was like this is like so many coins. I just think I felt like like it was historic. It was like it just kind of like really struck me, you know? It was like and I I had I had an ounce or two of gold, too. It wasn't like I didn't have any gold. Um so I bought another monster box, you know, and then I started buying blocks of it, you know, like those big blocks and stuff. on your desk the last time I saw you. >> Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. I I think I had like 2,000. I I That's back in like a storage vault now. But um because you can't keep that stuff around, you know, it's too takes up too much space. You got to rent a storage. That's the thing. You got to rent a space for it. I mean, it's like an armed vault for it. >> So, I I I think the answer is is that I really do not think it's cool anymore because um maybe my life has changed. You know, I just think that like when you have a pallet of the stuff, it's like it starts to become a burden. And and and you know, the gold the amount of space the gold takes up is infinitely smaller. I mean, you can at the storage, you know, private storage place, they'll rent you like a little drawer to put the gold in. And it's better than renting like pallet space for the silver. And I just think, you know, if people are new to this, like try to not be so binary with your thinking, like it's okay to buy something because you think it's fun, you know, like to buy yourself a block of silver, a tube of coins, you know, an old gold coin because you think it's cool. You can you can geek out is what the young people call this. You can geek out on these investments and you're going to learn something and they're they they've gone up in value. But I think the trouble is when you become like a silver bug or a gold bug or an anything bug or a crypto bug, it's really dangerous because what happens is you can't see anything else. It's all you can see and you just ignore everything that doesn't agree with you. >> And so, you know, for me, I I still have all the silver. Um, it's not performed as well as shares of the Triple Q would have. Not that we're going to compare apples to apples there, but I'm just saying that like there hasn't been a monetary reward >> that's matched the overall market. However, it does look like it's going to 100. The reason I say that is because I am intimately familiar with how the market works and it does not look like it's having a good time right now. So like so it probably is going to go up a little bit more and you have to ask yourself why are people so excited because if it goes to 100 that's that's you know like what 60% rise from here. >> Mhm. >> I mean it's not that much. So uh when you look at precious metals, I always call the fundamentals the big three uh anti-doll sentiment, you know, to deteriorating US finances and eroding Fed credibility. Do you >> spend a lot of time on underlying fundamentals? >> Zero. Zero. I think to me to me that all goes out the window once you spend some time you know in the money hubs like >> you know central Europe and um I was just in UAE. I mean you start your your perspective really changes and you realize that like we're going to digitize the whole thing. >> The whole thing is going to be digital trade. If I come up there and buy you a coffee they're going to know exactly who paid and you know where we enjoyed it and everything. and I had four cups and that's too many and you know it's going to be you know terrible. But um so you start saying to yourself that's really the reason to have some is not to evade that either by the way. What I'm saying is like I look at everything as if a relative came to me and said I got this million dollars and what should I do? >> And the answer is let's let's we're going to make a pie chart. We can make it with crayons if we don't have a computer. And you know, we're gonna we're going to put a little bit of it in these different things. That's what we're going to do because our goal is to is to sort of like keep you well off. That's our goal. >> And once you see it like that and you realize that, you know, there's a reason why wealthy people and other outside of the US, you know, are like have significantly overpositioned in gold compared to the average US person. >> Yeah. this dollar thing. It's like, who really cares? I mean, you're going to have stable coins, you're going to have Fedcoin, you're going to have a new Fed. It's not going to be the same Fed. They're going to allow the Fed to kind of collapse under the weight of like press and, you know, yeah, finally, let's really look into this thing, you know, and it's like it's a hundred years too late, right? And so, you know, it goes away and then a new bigger, stronger, safer Fed comes and, you know, it includes all the stable coins and that's where all the money's moving right now anyway. and it's, you know, more equipped to control you and you'll be thinking, boy, that old Fed wasn't so bad. Uh, so that's how I look at the dollar. I'm just like, it doesn't really matter. I mean, sort of like you need it to function. You really need it to function. I mean, who's really storing physical dollars, you know? It's not that many people. I mean, like like housewives, you know, in overseas maybe are storing some dollars, but that's fine. I mean, it's not really my position. But like, you know, will the dollar go why would the dollar go up? I mean, why would it not go down? I mean, that's the better question. It's like, why do these people It always blows my mind that the average, you know, middle class American is just like beside themselves that the dollar wouldn't go up. It's like, well, who's who's doing you any favors? I mean, like I have a cousin that's a congressman. Like, you know, he ain't doing me any favors. You know, I'm asking you for favors. You know what I mean? It's like it's like nobody's going to help you, right? Like, nobody's Come on, get out of here. Like, you've lost your mind. The thing is is that you they want it to be a controlled decline. That's the deal. It needs to be a graceful decline. And uh so once you see that becomes a little easier, you know, it's not anybody's job and you don't have to go buy 100% gold. But I think if you go back to my book and you you know, you had a small percentage of gold, you're pretty happy about that. >> You're happy about that. >> Commenting early uh you I think you were in Morocco at the time. there was a pool behind you and you were talking about how gold stocks were probably not worth, you know, the trouble. Um, and not that I disagree with you, they're a very uh complicated business with a lot of impediments and certainly over long periods since 2000, there have been periods where a lot of capital's been malinvested, etc. But since you were talking in early 2025, they've obviously done pretty well. I think the GDX is up like 160%. Do you still >> Do you still >> I think Yeah, I mean GDXJ is 144. Uh I mean I've got them all over here. You know, this is this is all these different screens. I mean the thing that that that to me is is stunning is the gold price is up this year 60%. And if you win around Denver gold show or something, one of these like, you know, poorly attended shows, and you're like, the gold price is going to be up 60%, it's going to be $4,200 an ounce. It's going to be sustained there, you know, like not like a day. What's your stock price? >> All of them would have told you 10x. >> Mhm. >> They would have all told you 10x. And some of them, you know, in this list are up, you know, 150% and, you know, 70% and 200%. I mean, they're not all up, you know, tremendous, but they didn't they didn't really do anything for about 10 years, you know. So, it's like except issue stock and pay themselves a lot, >> right? That was >> I just don't >> what I don't understand is the enthusiasm. And I think you need to understand also that I've been on boards in the industry. I've resigned from boards in the industry. I'll say that one more time. I resigned from boards in the industry. What does that tell you? >> Um, and not because of like a bad disagreement because like I just don't get it. I mean, I'm like there your story is operating leverage to a rising metal price, but the metal price has been rising a lot. I mean, I know because I wrote a book about it. Mhm. >> And your stock is Yeah. I mean, it's going up. It better be going up, >> right? >> Like, >> so we'll we'll we'll leave the the gold question for a minute. And I just think uh I'd ask you uh you know, what do you see from other than buying your letter, which I would encourage everyone to look at because it sounds fascinating. What do you see coming in 2026? And how should people be preparing for these challenges? Well, I don't want I don't want to tell everything because we're going to we're going to talk about this in the newsletter. I want to be fair to people, but I think there's going to be one sector, one innovative sector that's going to surprise everybody next year. I think it's going to attract a lot of capital. >> I think it's I think there's so much money in the Western world, it's unbelievable. And people have a hard time with that because they say, "Well, I need some of that money." Well, it's like you need a bigger idea >> because if you notice when you have a big idea, you've got people shoveling money at the idea. So, I think there's one industry that we're we're going to be talking about in the next issue that >> we're we have three stocks. First of all, there's a founder letter as well with the with the newsletter. >> We talked about a stock in there in this industry that's like, you know, very small market cap. You know, that's a small that's kind of like a next level of the newsletter. we don't really have a portfolio in there, but sometimes I'll learn something that's like not really meant for the full audience. It's too it's just too dangerous. But um I was taking some extra time to explain to the founders, you know, it's there's like a quarterly note to the founders that this is what's interesting to me is that you see this industry that's cracking out of its eggshell and there's all these little companies around that are going to float up with it and it's some of them will fail, some of them will go up 10 times and then they'll fail, but doesn't really matter. It's like this is what happens when you catch a trend. It's kind of like the gold business, you know, it never really regained its 70s glory, >> you know, like most of the people were kind of looking for that again. When it ran in 2000, most of the people making that run were people from the 70s that were now retired. It never really hit. The story never caught on. You know, there's no young person that's like, I want to own a gold miner. There's just like a couple thousand angry people in Vancouver that want to own gold miners. But, you know, my point is you want a giant audience >> for a story. there's millions of people and they look at something and they go, "Wow, that's cool and I want to buy it." Uh, okay. So, that's one thing. Second thing is I think Bitcoin is going to surprise people because there's so much negativity. It's unbelievable. I mean, I'll even in this video right now there'll be 50 uh juvenile comments in the bottom about this statement, but I bet you next year when you look back, I mean, Bitcoin's flat for the year. I think people kind of forget that it's flat for the year. And um 1.8 trillion market cap is pretty small when you compare that to you know the treasury issuance the the equity market the value of real estate value of gold 1.8 trillion is it 1 yeah 1.82 82 trillion. It's pretty small. And I think that, you know, in time the rest of the blockchain will get solved by quantum computing power. So that'll be done. And I think it'll become sort of a sought after, you know, thing people people want. And um I think it's a little crazy if you're somewhat young not to have a little tiny, you know, garnish of of Bitcoin. And I don't think that's the same for all the other coins to be honest with you. I don't really buy into it. Um, and I think a tiny tiny amount will do. You know, I don't think it's like with gold. You know, you didn't need to be 20% gold. >> Could have been 3% gold >> and it tripled. So now you're 10% gold, which is like really plenty, you know, because I mean, you know, it's like you're picture yourself as like your own central bank. >> You know, you don't really need that much gold, you know? It's not really like something that you're not running a gold company. you know, you're running your life. You're trying to live here, man. Because the the thing nobody tells you, Trey, is you're gonna die at some point. >> So, you gotta live, man. And um you know, you want to flow down the river of life. I mean, if you're you know, you're clinging to the edge, you're not you're not enjoying the ride. And so, uh that's that's two things that we're going to be talking about between now and the end of the year. I hope people will read. >> Excellent. Well, listen, Eie, thanks very much for your time. Uh good luck on your trip to New York. take those coats. Maybe play a little indoor tennis on 59th Street when you're there. >> Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. That's that's Sutton. Uh >> yeah, that's where I used >> the Sen bubble under the Cotch Bridge. Yeah. >> Terrific. Well, thanks for your time. Really appreciate it. Fascinating. And we if you're uh up for it, we'll check in with you in six months or so and see how you're doing. >> Sounds good. Look forward to it. >> Terrific. Thanks. Don't forget to sign up for a free portfolio review with one of our endorsed investment partners at wealthon.comfree. With markets hitting all-time highs, now is a great time to stress test your strategy and be prepared for what comes next. Thank you all for watching. We'll see you again next time.