The Top Investing Strategies For 2026 | Jonathan Wellum

Summary

• Market Outlook: Valuations are stretched and indexes may be flat in 2026, so the focus is on capital protection, hedges, and buying below intrinsic value with a 3-5 year horizon.
• AI: The trend remains strong but could see slowing growth; prefer picks-and-shovels like infrastructure and components (e.g., Brookfield, Prologis, Schneider Electric, Eaton) and overlooked software such as Roper Technologies (ROP).
• Precious Metals: Bullish long term due to global debt and fiat debasement; gold and silver seen as repricing higher with expected volatility, rotating from fully valued names into cheaper miners and adding select smaller operators.
• Silver Dynamics: Silver is catching up after years of underperformance, supported by production deficits, industrial demand, strategic importance, and tightening exports; expect sharp swings but a higher sustained range.
• Insurance (P&C): Property & casualty insurers look attractive near book with strong combined ratios below 90%, offering undervalued balance sheets and durable profitability.
• Oil & Gas: Positive on fossil fuels—especially natural gas—to power data centers; favor integrated producers and pipelines with solid free cash flow and dividends (e.g., Suncor (SU), Exxon (XOM), Canadian Natural (CNQ), Enbridge (ENB), TC Energy (TRP)).
• United States: Expects robust >5% GDP growth driven by pro-production policy, deregulation, reshoring, and potential rate cuts; global growth ex-US likely anemic, favoring firms with high US exposure.
• Risk Management: Maintain select cash (up to ~25%), avoid chasing winners, dollar-cost average into themes, and emphasize overlooked sectors and value discipline over index exposure.

Transcript

All right, and we should be live. Welcome to Thoughtful Money. I'm Thoughtful Money founder and your host, Adam Tagert, welcoming you here for a special edition Christmas Eve uh live stream with Jonathan Wellum, who is the CEO and founder of Rocklink Investment Partners, uh Thoughtful Money's endorsed financial adviser up in Canada. Jonathan, how are you? >> I'm doing very well, Adam, and uh looking forward to speaking with you and uh the listeners. >> Thank you. Well, I appreciate you doing this, especially on Christmas Eve. Um, and uh I believe you are in a warmer and sunnier place than your normal location of Canada. Correct. >> Yes. When you're in Canada, you try to get out of Canada, especially during the winter time. So, I am over Christmas time. I'm just down in Grand Cayman here. I just have a home down here. So, I'm enjoying my time down here, but working and keeping up with the markets and uh so uh no no no slack time here. We have an offshore fund uh in out of Cayman Island, so I can do a little business also. >> Wow. All right. Well, that sounds uh just wonderful. Uh I'm going to apologize in advance as folks can probably tell from my uh voice. I am uh get gutting through the flu here. I'm starting day four. So hopefully I'm I'm counting. This may be the the day I start turning the corner here. But I've got enough uh pseudafed or what is it? Nyquil in my system right now that hopefully I can power through this this conversation. But Jonathan, I might be leaning on you a lot here. So, um, I do have some questions for you and really it's all about looking ahead into the new year. Um, uh, but in addition to my questions, which are going to largely be around what key investment themes you at Rocklink, you and the team at Rocklink are are expecting for for 2026, uh, I'd love to let the audience uh, just ask way and ask any questions of you as well here. So, uh, why don't we why don't we start with that that topic, which is, um, okay, so we're really right at the end of 2025 here. Uh, the market, I think, has sold off a little bit since it opened this morning, but I believe it hit an all-time high again briefly. Um, we have a bunch of assets at all-time highs. So, Jonathan, as you look to 2026, what do you see? Is it is it more likely to be more the same? Will the momentum continue or especially since we've had three now backto-back years of double-digit returns, do you expect some sort of mean reversion to to come to play? >> Yeah, it's a great question. Um, and we're as as value investors, we typically look at the market from a three to fiveyear perspective and try to buy businesses that we believe are trading below intrinsic value. And as we've talked about before on your program, uh the markets are not cheap. So that they are they are expensive as you've said we've seen backtoback um very aggressive years in terms of returns in the market and so to expect a pullback in the markets and to have weaker markets I think is really what people should be thinking about more than uh more of the same and seeing another you know 15 20% rise next year that to me I would not I do not don't think that's a wise uh pro pro uh process wise way of looking at the market and so if it does go up 20% that's fine um That's great, but we want to be protecting ourselves. We want to have some hedges in. We want to make sure we're buying businesses that if the market were to go down quite a bit. Uh we would not go down anywhere near as as as much as the market because they're trading at better valuations. And so we're we're just being careful, cautious, and at the same time trying to find great investments that we can put money to work in for our investors because, you know, our investor our investors don't pay us to just sit in cash. Um we don't mind carrying 20 25% cash maybe maximum. when I say cash shorter term interestbearing securities but any more than that it's tough because uh um you know our investors are paying us to find deals find places to put money to work >> all right so when you look towards 2026 where do you see the opportunities right now >> yeah so if we were okay some of the some of the same trends that we have seen over the last number of years I think are going to continue to provide some opportunities it doesn't mean you buy just the leading companies that have done the best in those areas. So the whole AI trend is uh alive and well. Now we don't sit and focus on the Nvidia of the world. We try to look below the surface and okay let's find uh where we're going to need more base metals. Maybe it's copper copper assets we invest in, you know, in some of the commodity businesses. Maybe it's physical infrastructure um that we can take advantage of. So companies like Brookfield or Prologess uh are providing and getting some upside from a lot of the build that's going on. Maybe it's electrical utilities that have to be built out and so we can buy electrical component uh businesses like Schneider or Eaton things like that. So that trend I think is alive and well but you have to just be careful. I don't think you just go and pay anything uh just because the trend is still continuing to go forward. Our one of our concerns is that trend can slow down. we can get a you know a second derivative uh that's negative and all of a sudden the rate of growth is not going to be the same and it starts to slow down that will take some of the stocks down that are highly priced. So that trend is alive and well but be careful and look below the surface and try to find businesses that are better positioned trading at much better cash flow multiples and so you get some protection. Um I think the rotation another trend that we're looking at is just again more of a rotation in the market. We've had a lot of these high-flying companies, uh, the Mag 7, etc., do very well, and everybody's talked about that year after year after year. Well, eventually, there's no question we're going to come to a year and they're not going to perform very well. That's it's that's that's inevitable. We just don't know when that'll be. So, try to find some other businesses that have been completely overlooked. Part of the AI trade is put, I think, some of the software companies. Uh, people say software businesses will not do as well because of AI. Um, so we own companies like Roper Technologies, which we think again continues to grow and do very well. Hasn't had any slip up in terms of its opportunities to growth, but the stock's done nothing for two years. Um, and so valuations are quite attractive. So, we're looking at businesses like that. Um, some of the uh some of the manufacturer industrial businesses also uh have not done that well. Uh, and you know, are up maybe 20 25% over the last couple of years, but they're great companies and they're still continuing to grow. We own a company like Carl Companies which uh you know does all of the roofing you know flat roofs all of the industrial buildings across America and uh a few other countries and this thing's trading at u cheap multiples so that's another area look for businesses in areas that have been you know overlooked no one cares about those sectors uh and go into those areas and then um as we've talked about before I do think um you know precious metals uh is an area that you need to be careful um I do see more growth going forward, but it's done exceptionally well, the gold, the silver, the platinum, um, a lot of the base metals. And so, that's an area we continue to invest in. But, uh, we want to be careful. We've taken some money off the table uh, on some businesses that have done very well. And look, continue to rotate, uh, and, uh, find other businesses that we think will do well, um, that haven't, uh, gone up as much as the underlying commodities would should should reflect in terms of the stock price. So those are some of the areas that uh you know we're we're focusing on um in terms of uh opportunities to invest. >> Okay. And uh you know good worth reminding the audience here that your approach at uh at Rockland can correct me if I'm miscatategorizing this but it's it's very Buffettesque where you're you're not playing trends. You're not buying sector ETFs or things like that. you are doing the old-fashioned kind of gum chew due diligence work of trying to find uh underpriced value and companies that you would be excited to own for years and you're hopefully buying them at at entry prices that you feel good about um and then hopefully riding them until they get uh fully valued by the street. That's exactly the case and uh that's why we uh we'll we'll maybe focus on 20 25 stocks in in a portfolio and uh I mean we just a couple of days ago we were talking to an interesting like insurance is another area um insurance uh property casualty uh commercial insurance for businesses there are a number of insurance companies that are trading at uh very attractive prices you know just maybe just a little over book value investable assets per share are larger than their stock price um companies that have you know abilities to generate strong strong profits year after year with combined ratios way below uh 90%. Um so those are opportunities again. So so what we do is we're constantly looking below the surface and try not to get caught up with just all of the headline news which is not irrelevant don't get me wrong but there's a lot of businesses below the surface that people have just haven't really been looking at that much. Maybe they're not in all the index funds um but they're trading at great prices and overall uh as we know the stock market is a weighing machine over the long term and not just a voting machine. So I think again going into 2026 there's opportunities to invest but again be careful not just the ones that have done well over the last three four years they can't continue to compound at 20% a year. This is just not economically possible. And so investors need to be careful. It doesn't mean they have to run from the market. It just means they have to work harder to find out find you know businesses that are trading at much more attractive valuations. >> Okay. And you know nobody knows exactly what the future brings. So, you know, you're you're I'm asking you to guesstimate here a little bit, but uh we can certainly make an argument that the the market is overvalued, maybe dangerously overvalued, largely due to uh the just nosebleleed valuations of the hyperscalers here and their their disproportionate um percentage of the the major indices. Um, you know, you you can argue for an approach like yours that that says, "Hey, I'm I'm buying an undervalued asset and I'm going to ride I mean, you know, and and hopefully the market will eventually recognize its true value and I'll I'll I'll ride that." You can also say, "Hey, at a time when the market's really overvalued, it's kind of safer to be buying stocks that are have been kind of left behind because they don't have all the froth in them that the rest of the market does." And reason why I'm sort of contrasting those two is is what does your gut tell you 2026 is going to be more of for investors. Is it going to be a year of offense of trying to find the the the companies that are going to ride the next slingshot up or is it putting your capital in places that will be less impacted if indeed we finally have a you know the the bloom come off the rose for the AI mania? Yeah, I think it's I think it's to be very careful cautious and uh to really put your money into businesses you think that will protect your capital. Um I I don't think the topline indexes again we don't know and we try not to be you know prognosticate on this too much because uh um and no one knows what the next year is going to bring. But I would if I were a betting man I'm an investor. I'm not a betting man. But if I were a betting man, I would bet that the indexes are not up much uh when we come if we were speaking a year from now. Um that is just it's just the law of large numbers. Um the valuations, the price earnings ratios, the price to cash flow, they're all extended. The other thing I'd point out that we often don't talk about on on the programs, but um I think it's also important is that the United States is basically the only country that's driving a lot of economic growth. I mean um I'm in Canada. Um, so when I look at the Canadian situation, I look at just the tremendously poor decisions that are made at the federal government level, also our provinces, similar to your states, we have virtually no economic growth going on in our country. We have high taxations, high regulations, uh, stying our resource developments in the United States. Um, again, if I'm speaking mostly to Americans probably watching uh the program now and in the next number of days, >> you're in a very unique situation where you have, you know, taxes are being bas uh you've got capital coming into your country. You've got a government especially federally and most of your states that are are fasttracking resource projects to get done and and money is flowing into your country. um you know, you've thrown out all this DEI nonsense. You've thrown out the the the exceptional and extreme parts of ESG, the green agenda. This means economic growth. And so I think in the US, uh you're likely to see greater than 5% growth next year. Um there's already 4.3% whatever just recently. Um and I'd be shocked if it wasn't more than 5%. >> Around the world though, Europe is a mess. I mean, all they're all they're concerned about is is is restricting free uh free speech and uh and and communication of ideas and protecting the governments over there and uh regulating to death. There's virtually no growth in those countries. The UK is in serious position. So um and you know, China um you know, of course, the US is is pushing back against them and so on. So I think when you look around the world, global growth is going to be rather anemic um outside of the United States. And so um even when we're investing, we're continuing to look at companies that have large US exposure and companies that can profit from much more sane, rational economic policies that are coming out of the US. That doesn't mean they're perfect. The US has a large deficit. It has a $ 38 trillion debt. there's money, you know, the debts are intractable in one sense, but um at least there's the attempt to grow the economies, to expand the economies, to drop uh prices, to get inflation back in line. Uh and the only way you do that is produce, produce, produce, produce, and shrink the size of government. Um so that's only happening, I think, in one major country in the world, and that's in the US. The rest of the world is not doing that. And so I think that will constrain economic growth and make equity investors should be careful and cautious. Okay. Uh so let's dig into this a little bit. Um so first off, I believe that most other uh you know major economies are bumping up their fiscal stimulus now. Um so to a certain extent uh you know there are people that are thinking okay well then we're actually going to see some growth out of that uh next year. Um, sounds like maybe you differ from that. Um, >> well, the problem with some of that growth is, as we all know, um, is it's going to come just from government spending and more deficits and more debt. And, uh, that's again why you want to own precious metals for the long haul even though they've done well. And I think that's one reason why gold and silver have done so well, platinum, platium also, platinum I should say, because of the uh, maybe the less uh, green agenda and so on. But um that's because people are concerned about fiat currency. I mean I I think it's virtually impossible for our money including the US dollar to maintain uh significant purchasing power um over the long term uh with the US dollar probably still being the strongest which means all of the rest of them are worse. Um and so uh that that's a major issue. So yeah, you got Germany spending more money on military uh because uh you know, Trump's put pressure on NATO and so they're all opening the spigots over there. But that's all debt that will not create true long-term wealth for citizens. It will crowd out private capital. It will drive prices up. It'll drive standards of living down. And that's all we've seen throughout the last couple of decades in in the Western world as standards of living have collapsed with the uh increasing size of the government and bureaucracy. So what Europe's going to do is just they're going to compound their problems over there. So in the short run, yeah, investors can say, "Okay, maybe there's going to be some opportunities in some stocks." But longer term, they're basically um castrating their their economies uh and uh and and truncating wealth creation, which again has created some of the problems. I saw your interview recently with Matt Tib Ta Taibbe and um you know standards of living for the next generation are horrible and that's because we haven't been invest in investing in productive assets and the government is taking over more and more and state and and the debts have mounted and the central central banks have printed way too much money um and so that's not a recipe for wealth creation. Of course, in the US, I again, love Trump or hate him, it doesn't really matter. At least the economic policies ring true to something that's going to get back to some production of uh of goods and services and trying to bring uh inflation down as a result of that. That's the only way you're going to bring inflation down and to deal with wealth levels is to produce, produce, produce manufacturing uh um you know, onshore your manufacturing onshore. a lot of the production that was taken offshore and that will have longer term effects, positive effects. >> Okay. Um, so I want to get to the precious metals in just a moment based on some comments you made and that it's been a big focus of your uh your firm uh for years and this has been a phenomenal absolutely phenomenal year for them. But um a couple of things. So so you expect basically the US to outgrow um most of the rest of the world next year. And sounds like for for good reasons, right? It's it'll it'll be more organic productivity driven growth. Um and as a person living in the US, I I hope you're right. Um I want to I want to just make sure that folks are aware. um you know in in theory the markets and the economy are two different things and um while if one does well the other usually does well that does not need to be the case um and I think we've gotten to a point where the market has largely driven the economy a lot recently um and certainly um certainly all the uh capex spending and the hyperscalers that has you know sent their stocks to the moon has also been like the main engine of of GDP growth in the US until recently. But it sounds like you think next year, you know, the and correct me if I'm if I'm misinterpreting this, but that the the new administration's, you know, policies of of trying to spur um true domestic productive growth and and this has been things that have been, you know, put into the one big beautiful bill. And it's been deregulation and it's been uh new trade deals and it's been Trump getting other countries to promise to bring you know more manufacturing into the US and uh other foreign capital into the all that stuff you think is going to start actually you know producing real results. Um, so if that indeed is the case and we get the five plus percent GDP growth you think we might get, which would be amazing, um, doesn't necessarily mean that the stock market's going to do all that great because I think you said earlier, despite your 5% um, expectation for GDP, you wouldn't be surprised to have the markets be flat. >> That's that's exactly the case that often um, there's a separation uh, between the market performance and the underlying economic performance. And I think it's very important to point that out. Um and so we have to be cautious. I mean sometimes the market in the short run will will respond better if you're just cutting interest rates which we could see again uh next year. I mean that is what uh what the administration is trying to push for and uh the Fed governor that they're trying to put on um will probably be a little bit uh less hawkish on interest rates. That that too will also spur on some economic growth in the US. But it is important to point out that often um there is a you know the market will respond to uh uh a socialist government coming in and spending all sorts of money in the short run. Um but again I'm looking at things three to five years those short-term benefits if they're not long-term building wealth and building a capital base in an economy and and you don't have a rational tax structure and a regulatory regime that makes sense then eventually the stock market will go nowhere. But in the short run, you're quite right. Next year, um, with all of the right decisions being put into place, which will take some time to work out. This isn't going to radically, you know, you're going to need a number of years for capital to start coming back in the country for investments to be made. It doesn't doesn't change overnight. Of course, that's going to take many, many years, but uh the stock market uh might look through that and uh and and knock the valuations of stocks down in the short run. and we might not see the benefit in the stock market itself even though on main street things will be getting a little bit better hopefully. >> Yeah. And that's also folks too why valuations matter, right? Um you know if valuations I mean right now for a lot of assets they're at all-time highs, you know, record alltime highs, cape ratios, buffet indicator, all that type of stuff. >> And so uh you know when you buy high uh you you you know reversion of the mean, whatever, you know, uh, kicks in at some point. And so, even if the underlying economy starts growing, you've got to get your valuation down to a more uh, you're likely to have the valuation metrics come down to likely to to much more historical norms, which sometimes you can have a growing economy, but a flatter declining stock market. Um, all right. So, there's a a comment that that one of the folks mentioned here that I'll pull up in just a second. Um but you know when when Trump was coming into office um I think a lot of people had been pretty shocked that we didn't have the recession that everybody was expecting in 2022 and then 2023 and 2024 the recession didn't arrive um largely because of all the stimulus that was pushed out into the system. Um when when when the baton was handed off between Biden and Trump, I think a lot of people thought that, okay, well, we're surely going to have that recession now, and Trump would probably let it happen because he could blame it on Biden uh and lower his baseline and have a you know, lower point from which to uh make progress over his his uh four years. Um didn't happen. And um you know again Jonathan you and I could spend tons of time looking at a lot of recessionary type data. Um but you know like today we just got the the latest initial jobs claims. Um they were they were pretty fine and we can debate the quality of the um the jobs data and whatnot. But um while there's lots of parts of the economy that still seem sluggish um to your point um there's also you know reason to expect that that economic growth could be pretty robust next year. So uh this user just asks I think Trump's going to thread the needle and my question here to you is is that what you think? I mean, if you're thinking 5% GDP growth next year, then that would really require us avoiding a recession and and going straight into, you know, much higher growth as the president has said was his goal. >> He he might I mean, again, we don't know and we we we invest in businesses and try to find them as I you know, they said before that are trading below intrinsic value and all of that sort of stuff so we can protect ourselves. But if we step out of that for a moment, um he might thread the needle. I mean, Bent is is pretty adamant that they're going to have heavy uh you know, significant growth next year. The other the other factor I think you have to realize is there's so many moving things going on in the US right now. Um immigration has just been cut. Um you actually have net migration out of the country because people are leaving. Uh again, but you're those people leaving are net cost. I mean, yeah, okay, you can hire them at a slightly lower price and things like that, but look at the new jobs in the United States in contrast to what we have up here in Canada where almost all the jobs are going to people coming into the country and none of the Canadians that have actually built the country are are getting jobs. Um, in the United States, all of the new jobs are are going to actually Americans. Um, this is a good thing. So there's so much detox going on I think with the bad policies over the last number of years not just Biden but really going back a couple of decades. We see this in all of our western countries. Um there's trying to stabilize things in the US and I think that that will um and might have a very positive impact on the economy much more so than the typical economists I think are seeing. Um how can you take you know several million people out of the country? That's going to help on real estate prices going down, rental costs going down, inflation issues should be better off because of that. But anytime you can hire your own domestic people and try to cut social welfare and costs in your system, uh that's a good thing. Look at the abuse that's come out of many Minnesota, California. Um again, we not to pick on you guys. We've got abuse up here in Canada, but you you can't run a you can't run an economy where you've got literally millions of people just living off the system um and taking money. So, anytime you can start cleaning up some of this mess, um it's going to have positive impact uh on the economy. So, um I think that he might thread the needle. Who knows? But I I go back to his policies. He's doing the kind of economic policies that will result over time in the production of more goods, more services, more capital being put to work, expensing it quickly so that money can come into the country and allowing people to make profits and reinvest back in their business. That's what drives an economy. I don't know, you know, I don't know what economics courses other people have taken, but uh um that that's that that's what uh we all know is going to work over the long term. If you can get interest rates down, also your cost of money, that's just going to feed the situation. So, with the new uh Fed governor coming in next year and maybe rates coming down a little bit more aggressively than under Jay Powell, that also will give Trump a little bit of wind under the sales. So, that could again help him thread the needle. We'll have to see. Um it's going to be interesting. >> Okay. So the reason why I wanted to kind of dig into this was um you know we certainly had plenty of guests on this channel over the past year who have been very concerned about where the economy was headed and uh and we've talked about the K-shaped economy and you know the bottom say 80% you know struggling and and and falling further behind and all that stuff. Um, and so, you know, that that can paint a a a dark picture for 2026, right, of okay, well, you know, likely to fall into recession as those consumers just tap out and, you know, we saw, you know, record bankruptcies this year or at least bankruptcies at a rate we hadn't seen since the global financial crisis and all that type of stuff. And so it sounds like what you're saying is is yeah, that data has been out there, but be careful if your default assumption is recession and doom and gloom for for 2026. Uh at least in the US, you you you see on a net basis room for optimism versus pessimism. Well, I do in those in those policies having having um those are the kind of policies that do drive economic growth that you're also going to see a cut in taxes on social security. You're going to see no tax on tips coming into place into 2026. Those all help um pretty average people um you know main street type of things. So I think that interestingly enough I mean Scott Descent has talked about this Trump also I mean they're trying to and JD Vance they're trying to actually re reinvigorate Main Street and not Wall Street. Now, if if they can pull that off by again getting jobs back into the economy, manufacturing, onshoring things, getting capital into more businesses, um if they can pull that off and get the uh standard of living increasing and the cost of housing down, um this could be a wonderful thing for the average uh American and in terms of their net worth actually going up for once. That did happen under the first four years under Trump as you know. Um so um again you're trying to reverse this massive massive expansion of the state the massive expansion of regulation and taxation uh which has just been irre you know without without end in sight and along with uh this attack on the um economy through the whole green agenda and the the I'm talking about the extreme by environmentalism which just increased all of all the costs of production and manufacturing. If you start unwinding all of that, I think it could be incredibly positive. That's that's my view. Now, it's not easy and it won't be smooth and the US still has a large deficit and it has a big accumulated debt and it's got a lot of unfunded liabilities. So, this is an ongoing challenge and I think that as investors that's why you balance out your portfolio, you have some diversification, but at the same time, I would not be running for the hills. I'd be looking for investment opportunities. >> Okay, great. Um all right. So uh well moving on from this then uh to precious metals. Um they have had I mean Jonathan you and I have known each other long enough that uh you know we're both folks that kind of bought into the reasons to buy precious metals trade a good long time ago. Um your firm has made them a focus area. All that said, I'm going to bet like me, you didn't expect 2025 was going to be as amazing a year for them as it has been. Um, and so I guess my question to you is is let's talk about where you think they're going to go in 2025. But I guess first and foremost, um, what do you think about where they are right now? Um, you know, both gold and silver at all-time highs. Silver has just been on an absolute tear. Is is this a fundamental repricing? Is this just sort of a new price era for this? Or as we've seen with these metals in the past when they have gone up exponentially like this, it's a very finite peak and then it usually craters by like 2/3 and becomes dead money for years. >> Yeah, I I firmly believe and of course I could be wrong, but I firmly believe that it it is a repricing of the underlying precious metals. And the reason I say that is because of the massive buildup of debt. So if you look at the the the gold price, I mean I think it's playing catchup uh to the expansion of the global debts uh global debt um that's been accumulated over the last number of decades and that just continues the money printing that's that's gone on the last 10 years and then was you know put through the co years and it's never really gotten anywhere near where it uh back to where it was previous to co. So we've got this money up there. Now you got the Fed going back and saying it's building up its reserves again, which means it's just printing more money and buying buying short-term treasuries. So, um, yeah, I think it's a repricing because of the massive buildup of debt, which is three three and a half times, you know, global GDP, uh, if you look at all of the debt that's been accumulated around the world. And so, um, that that's the issue. I think silver picking up this year, I mean, silver has just been a lagard. Um when you compare silver to gold again I I don't get caught up too much in ratios but the ratio when it starts to become 100 to1 when the actual production is you know 8:1 um when we've been in deficit on the uh on the production of uh silver in other words we're using more silver than what's been produced for the last five years um when you put all of that together I think silver is playing catch-up and uh the paper markets are not dominating as much as they have were and I think the physical uh the physical need, the strategic nature of it, uh the fact that China says they're not going to be exporting out of their country come uh January 1st, all of these factors are feeding into uh the demand for silver uh and um and the fact that it's been undervalued and has to be repriced in order to produce more uh more of it so that we can again use it in a lot of our future technologies. >> All right. So, at Rocklink then, you know, you've had this phenomenal year. A lot of your precious metals holdings have done very, very well. Um, what are you doing? Are you are you taking any profits here? Are you just letting it ride? Are you maybe thinking that, okay, it's had a fantastic year this year, probably won't next year, so let's decrease the percentage relative to other sectors we think could do better next year. How are you reacting to this bonanza that we've had in the precious metals this year? >> Yeah, it's been and it has been quite a bonanza and just just you had mentioned before uh about our expectations and uh we did think again, you know, we we see it trading up higher um for 2025, but not as much as it went up. I mean, you never can you I would never put my finger up in the air and say it's going to go up 70 odd percent and silver is going to go up over 100%. That would you just you just don't build those into your expectations. You want to be careful. I think silver's like 150% now. >> Yeah, because it started around 28. So, somewhere around 28. Yeah. So, >> it hit 72 this morning. I think it's down to 70 something right now. But, yeah. >> Yeah. And I think investors should continue to expect again a lot of volatility. So, I think you're going to see $100 moves in gold because as a percentage uh change, of course, it's it's smaller when you're building off of a $4,500 base. And the same thing with silver. Whenever you've had this extension like this in price, it's going to be more even more volatile. That shouldn't throw people off. So longer term, Adam, to answer your question, we want to be in the space because the longer term um issues that have been propelling silver and gold um are not have not disappeared. So those are the big macro factors and even with the US growing at you know I I I think it will grow about 5% next year uh in terms of the economy it's still got a massive deficit and so it's still piling debt you know and adding to its debt pile and and and that's one of the stronger countries as we already talked about Europe is going to be you know they're they're opening the spigot and spending more money over there uh on military and so on. China who knows what they're doing Japan's is is a debt quagmire and so forth. So, um, so all of those reasons mean that we don't really trust paper money and so we don't trust the paper, you know, the value of it and so we want to be in precious metals. But right now, we've done exceptionally well. So, yeah, we've we've taken some money off of the table, especially if it's someone's waiting gets way too large um, in the terms of their portfolio, we'll pull it back. And we've also tried to redeploy from some of the more highly valued securities, ones that have done really well and are trading at a higher priced and net net asset value multiple. Then we try to find other businesses that are trading at a lower price to net asset value multiple and have better growth prospects. And we've even gone down um in a couple of cases. I spent uh some time in Switzerland at a at a precious metals conference and we've talked to a lot of smaller companies. We've actually added a couple of smaller mining companies that are trading at we believe at very inexpensive prices um so that we can again try to get more upside um by buying cheaper companies, cheaper valued businesses but with a lot of upside that are run by incredibly good people and are backed by um a lot of billionaires. So um so we have tried to again alter our waitings and reposition some of our stocks just because they've done so well this year in our portfolios and then add a few smaller ones that um we think have tremendous upside opportunities and the market just doesn't care because it's focused on the larger the larger miners or larger royalty companies. >> Okay. And and how worried are you about just a a pullback in the prices of the the metals themselves given how far and how fast they've run of late? Yeah, I'm not know I don't know if I'm worried, but um we certainly are telling our investors be cautious, be careful. We can get a a step back and that could create some volatility and they should expect that and that would will show up in their portfolio numbers. So they get their statements, they go, geez, you know, we're down 5 10% on our overall statement because you know precious metals might be down 20%. Um then they just that's just the way it is. You can't go up 25, some of our clients are up 25, 30, 35% this past year. Um, you can't go up that much in one year without giving back a little bit. What we just want to be careful that we're not trying to be too super smart when it comes to uh market timing. >> Um, market timing is incredibly difficult, especially if the longer term trend is in place. If the longer term trend wasn't in place and all of a sudden all the all the governments around the world were, you know, not constraining our our our our free speech and they were cutting taxes and cutting regulations and and balancing budgets, then we'd be out of gold. We'd be out of silver, right? We don't see any of that happening. In fact, on the contrary, we see governments going in the wrong direction with the exception of a handful of governments, you know, and you know, down El Salvador, you've got a better government. You got Argentina trying to do some better things. Chile just elected a more conservative government. Eastern Europe's got a few governments that you know make sense. You know, Hungary and so on, but other than these are a handful of governments. Other than that, the it's full steam ahead self-destruction and suicide. So, um so, you know, we we we want to continue to own them, but whenever you go up a lot, it is healthy to clean out the system a bit and we should expect some pullbacks. If they don't come, fine. But we should expect the pullbacks and then you can dollar cost average and you can buy, you know, line up the businesses that you really want to buy. Wait, be patient. If they come off, then you can step up and buy more. So, please uh for people if you are if you haven't been in the space, I even had a couple investors um email me this past week saying, "Where can I buy physical gold?" You know, I I want to buy physical gold. I'm thinking, oh no, maybe we are getting near the top. Um and and you try to tell people if you haven't even been invested at all in the space, please just dollar cost average, buy high quality. Um go slow to go fast. Don't just jump in with both feet. You could end up, you know, dropping 20 25%. And uh and then pull all your money out at the bottom and lock in a loss. That's the way people often operate. Hey, you buy high, sell low. No, you want to buy low and you want a dollar cost average into this if it's an ongoing trend that's going to be there for the next five to 10 years. >> Okay. And just for those people that may be interested in buying physical gold or physical silver, um just a reminder, you can do that at ThoughtfulMoney's uh endorsed provider. Uh the folks at Miles Franklin, that's Andy Sheckchman's shop. Uh you can go to thoughtfulmoney.com/bygold. Uh he can handle clients both in the US and in Canada. And just a reminder, folks, that uh while supplies last, and they're still lasting, um Andy is offering this audience the exclusive deal of being able to buy junk silver from Miles Franklin for uh a dollar under spot. Um Andy says he's never seen that abil never had that ability to do that before. So, if that's something that's of interest to you, go fill out the very short form there at thoughtfulmoney.combygold and Andy and his team will will help you there for for that offer or any of your um gold and silver buying needs. Um, all right, Jonathan, >> and andy's fantastic. I love uh the programs you do with Andy and I follow him uh and his knowledge uh of the industry. We we use that to help inform us also and uh have great respect for Miles Franklin. Yeah. >> Well, thank you. Um, one of the one of the things I really appreciate about talking to Andy is he he really has his finger on the pulse of what's happening with the flow of physical inventory. And um, obviously there's been a lot of bottlenecks uh, in the supply system um, as more and more players have been stepping up and demanding delivery, which I think is a big part of what's been catapulting the silver prices of late. And in some ways that that excites me as a as a precious metals holder um because it it lets me know that okay you know this this thing that I own is becoming more scarce. Um on the other hand I know that inventory scarcesses or scarcities usually don't last forever. Um, and so one big question mark I do have, which I'll be talking with Andy more going forward from here, is just, hey, if the if if they're able to start, you know, removing some of these supply bottlenecks, does that pose a risk of of the price actually dropping materially? Um, I don't know. TBD, we'll see what Andy has to say about it. Um, it look, could supply get even tighter from here? Absolutely. So, um it's not something I think is necessarily going to happen tomorrow, but it's just a it's a potential risk. >> Yes. Well, and and I know we've had we've had a slowdown in some of the uh the green agenda, and again, I'm all I'm all for, you know, environmental u you know, control and and and in terms of looking after the environment, but but the extreme agenda was pushing things a a little bit of faster rate with the EVs and so forth. But with the new battery technology and some of the stuff that's coming down the pipe, I mean, the the demand for uh silver is pretty significant. Um it's not these are big numbers. I don't even like to throw out the numbers. They're pretty large and the and the deficiencies or the deficit that we go into can become very large quickly um in the next number of years. And so it'll be interesting to see if corporations step up and try to hedge themselves and uh buy into the space. I I that would not surprise me at all. That's we certainly are hearing more and more about that. Um but it's a strategic asset. The Trump the Trump government made uh again silver strategic asset because it is and um and so this days of I think low prices and silver are probably behind us um because of just the demand and it's and producing it's hard to produce the level of silver that we're using. So >> yeah. Well, I mean that's for for folks like us who have been buying silver for years. You know, that was sort of a trend that we've been seeing coming. Um, and you know, it'll it'll be interesting to see. I mean, we we certainly know that silver in terms of mining output, um, it's becoming harder and harder to find. Um, you know, certainly in in a pure silver mine, u, the vast majority of silver that's mined, as you know, Jonathan, is a byproduct. other type of mining. Um, and it's because humans being humans over the past bunch of centuries, we went after the easy stuff first. And um, there's not a lot of easy stuff left when it comes to silver. So, you know, you you get you get sort of dwindling um, you know, uh, pure supply uh, in in the earth and then you get increased demand from industry and whatnot, you know. Yeah. I mean, it's those macro trends are big reasons why I and a lot of other people, you know, got into silver in addition to the monetary side of things as well. Um, so so we'll see. I I just again I I kind of just am raising some of these concerns because, you know, Americans being Americans, for some reason, we love to buy things when they're running away in price to the upside, right? And uh oftentimes you're putting yourself at uh risk of cooling off or aversion of the mean or whatnot. And I just want to, you know, make sure that folks aren't aren't jumping in, especially if they're first-time precious metals buyers right now. Um at least not being cognizant of the fact that things are running pretty white hot right now. >> Yeah. And I think you and you start to see all these um uh video clips and blogs and so forth talking about tripledigit silver and even I I even saw one this morning. I was just paging through a YouTube I think it said four fourdigit silver and of course people just start salivating then and who I mean we don't know what that's going to you have to buy today based upon reasonable economics and you want to buy at a discount. You don't want to be paying full price. And that's the that's why we tell people if you haven't been in just dollar cost average, develop a systematic approach so that if you're buying at 70 and all of a sudden it goes to 50, which it could go to 50. It could go to 50 quickly and then back to 80 um and and up to 80 and so forth, then you're dollar cost averaging and you're not panicking out. The worst thing is you you feel that you've miss you're missing out. This fear of missing out. You buy at 71, it goes to 50, you panic out, and you go, I'm stupid. I'm I'm locking in my loss. And then you don't go back in again until it's 100. And we see this all of the time. And the only way you can avoid that is you've got to be self-conscious here about what you're doing. And you have to have a disciplined investment pro process and policies into place. Uh because even as a professional, I've been investing for 36 years. When that thing it's a lot easier when some to buy when something's going up, I'll say the same thing. But then I have to slap myself and say, "Jonathan, go back to the principles, back to the numbers, run the spreadsheets." Um, be be careful. Uh, dollar cost average, wait. Um, you have to do that or you're going to get your head handed to you. >> Yeah. All right. Very well said. All right. Well, look, Jonathan, I'm going to uh I'll try to grab one or two questions here from the audience. Um, but before we do, is there anything that you and the team at Rocklink are, you know, really focused on for for heading into next year that I haven't thought to ask you about already? >> Um, uh, I don't think so. I mean, we again, we're constantly looking at different, um, niches, running screens on different sectors, trying to find, uh, unique opportunities um, that are in the marketplace. uh that's just what we do. I think the larger term trends, a lot of people know what they are. They are major trends. They're not going away. You know, digitization, robotics, AI, all of that. But the issue, I think, is just be careful what you pay and see if you can't find businesses that are below the surface that can also benefit from these longer term trends. But you're paying maybe half, maybe a quarter, even a quarter of the cash flow uh valuation multiples, and you're getting businesses that are growing very quickly. So, um, just be careful. Um, uh, look below the surface, uh, and dollar cost average. The overall indexes are high. They're not cheap. And, um, and it's perfectly reasonable if they come off a fair bit, uh, in 2026, even if the economies are doing well. And so, again, just be patient, be careful, know what you're buying, know why you're buying it, have the right time horizons. If you need to spend the money in a year or two, please don't be putting it in the stock market. um that's for longer term money three at least three years but more like five years out then you can you know you can weather the ups and downs um and sleep well at night so just again these are just very practical things that people need to be be consider investing >> all right Jonah what do you think about um oil and gas uh the oil and gas sector right now >> yeah I mean we we um again if you go back to these longer term trends also uh that require more energy so if we're going build even half the data centers that they're talking about let alone you know even if we don't build all of them even if we build some of them and we have digitization robotics and all of that we we have an increasing demand for energy and uh for for many years in North America energy demand was kind of flat even though we are growing our GDP just because of efficiencies and uh we were driving uh you know productivity using our energy uh more more more effectively but to have energy growing at 3 to 4% a year overall that those are large large numbers it compounds. So I think the oil and gas sector um is uh is an area for opportunities. We do have some investments in that space. I didn't mention it. So um you're quite right. We do have uh some even in some of the um the pipeline business. We have some inbridge, some in TC Energy, which is the old TransCanada. They got rid of the Canada name because most of it's in the US. Um but uh we have some Suncor. Um Exxon's another one that's just boring, boring, boring, but it's big. It's got low cost of capital. It's got a big dividend. Um they got their religion back and focused on fossil fuels instead of getting in a whole bunch of other areas. Um we have companies like CNQ, uh Canadian Natural. So yes, uh the valuations in the energy space are quite cheap. Cash flow multiples are quite low and we're going to need fossil fuels from here through our lifetimes uh and more. Um, so, uh, I think this idea that, uh, you know, fossil fuels are antiquated, they're going to go away is crazy, especially natural gas, uh, which is going to be very important to, uh, to to to power a lot of these, um, data centers. So, we focus a little bit more on some of our Canadian companies up here. Um, they're pretty cheap, but, you know, there's a number in the US. So, I would encourage investors also, don't overlook the space. It is cheap. It is inexpensive. It's sort of an out of favor. And um but uh again the the the cost you know the drop off in terms of production in uh in some of the fracking areas um I think will keep the price up um probably you know the 50s and 60s and so find companies that can make money good money good free cash flow at uh at $55 a barrel. Um and uh I think the you know the trend probably is it sneaks up a little bit higher than that um over time simply because that you just need that amount of of uh barrels the cost per barrel in order to keep the production going continue to invest back in the industry. And so a lot of these companies I like them because they have good dividends and they're also buying back stock and uh investing in the future too. So yeah some opportunities in that space also. >> All right. Yeah. To me, you don't have to share this, but to me, it this sector, it smells a little familiar to me to to the mining sector, you know, a couple years ago where it just felt like it was really being overlooked. Um, and that it strategic value was substantially higher than what the market was giving it credit for. And I think the difference at least with with the oil and gas sector versus the mining sector a couple years ago is that while you're while you're waiting in those stocks, you at least get paid pretty generously in the oil and gas space. >> Yeah. >> Yeah. >> Yeah. the c the cash flow in and just a little while ago we own one company up here in Canada called Meg Energy and it's got taken out unfortunately at at a price which you know we made money on it but we thought it was uh being as a take under basically but but at one point the free cash flow yields on these things were like 15 16%. It's and so they they were in in five or six years they could buy back the whole business uh and and they were you know buying back stock that had dividends um and uh paying down debt and so forth and in a matter of years they could buy back the whole business and take it private. That's how high some of these free cash flow yields were and some of them even reached up as high as 20% at one point and uh you can't avoid business like that. you have to put some dollars into them. And uh I think Rick Rule said it very well at a conference I recently attended and I think he's repeated this a number of times and probably when you've interviewed him and I appreciate Rick he's he's he's great when it comes to the commodities. He says you buy what people hate. So if they hate the sector that's when you buy and I think that's a very quick and easy way to remember things. If people are really down in the sector and it's broadly despised, then you should be looking at that sector very intently for investment opportunities, it's probably a great spot to be harvesting some opportunities. >> Okay. So, another good sort of dollar cost average play for the next year plus. >> Yeah. And and again, you go back to the longer term trends. If you want to bury this and you say, "Okay, I believe in AI. I believe in data centers. I believe in digitization. I believe we're going to have robots in our houses and so forth." And you go through all of that. We need energy and so nuclear, yeah, we own some chemico, but that's going to take a while. It takes a long time to build nuclear facilities. Um the the fastest way to get that energy is fossil fuels, especially natural gas. And um that's the way the market's moving. And uh and and so again, look at those areas in terms of opportunities. Yeah. >> Okay. Um, not that you have to have an opinion on this, but uh, there was some discussion earlier on in the live chat here about Bitcoin. Um, do you and your team there at Rocklink have any any strong opinions one way or the other on Bitcoin, especially looking into next year? >> Yeah, and I know the Bitcoin the Bitcoin question. And it's almost like I'm I'm too old to uh get excited about uh Bitcoin. But um I I still like things that are tangible, I can touch, that are real, and I have a I have a difficult time um um getting overly excited about something that's completely digital like Bitcoin. Having said all that, I'm sympathetic to the cryptocurrencies. I don't like fiat currency. I don't trust fiat currency. Um that's why I'm a gold investor. And so, um, uh, but from our perspective, I'd rather go into the gold, the silver, the precious metals. Um, and if I'm going to tokenize anything, um, I I like what Tether's doing by tokenizing, uh, the gold royalty companies and backing it by by gold rather than, uh, um, by cryptocurrency. So, I'm not a big fan of the cryptocurrencies. I'm not negative on them. Um, we do have some clients that, uh, insist on owning some and we put them, you know, some of their portfolios. Um, I I'd say I'm sort of um um indifferent to it and uh I I just prefer to go what where I understand um the investment better and I I appreciate precious metals better. Um to me, Bitcoin and some of the other cryptocurrencies could go almost anywhere. What I think is incredibly valuable is the blockchain. It's the blockchain that's valuable. That's where, you know, for we look at tokenization, look at some of the companies that are involved there. if they were ever reasonable value. Some of them are just trading at crazy prices like Circle and so on. Uh we would step in and buy some of those, but uh right now they're just trading at too high valuations. But the blockchain is powerful, what trades on it. Again, I just I don't I just have a hard time valuing them and understanding um um how you put a true long-term value on stuff like Bitcoin or Ethereum and so forth. Yeah. >> Okay. All right. I'll take one last question here from the audience then we'll wrap things up here. Um, okay. Uh, hey guys, a Romanian here. Do you think the global economic trend is moving towards a neo medieval economy in the sense that we will have an owner class and a rentier class in the future? Uh, this is something just to let you know, Jonathan being totally transparent, something I've worn about a lot on this channel. Um, we talk a lot about the K-shaped economy. My regular viewers here have have told me say I I think it's in danger of morphing into a lowercase Ishaped economy where you know you have the habs or the little dot uh elevated above everybody else by themselves and then the the majority is the the stick below getting increasingly left behind. Um, uh, I've even said it, you know, America, if it hasn't already gotten there, isn't is dangerously close to becoming an aristocracy where I mean, it's true at this point in time, the the number one predictor of your economic success in life is where you where you're born to wealthy parents or not. At this point, um the uh the amount of assets that are are held by the top 10%, especially the top 1% and especially the top.1% um are uh just it's a different stratosphere than everybody who's not in those those those uh cohorts. Um and sadly that wealth gap is still continues to to widen. And you know, I know you were talking earlier about, you know, the new administration talking about, hey, it's it's we want to do more for Main Street than for Wall Street. I I hope that is their intent and I hope that is the effect of their policies. But a lot of their policies still today, you know, are business as usual that are driving asset prices higher. And as long as that happens, it is benefiting vastly disproportionately the the minority that owns those assets, right? and everybody else is feeling further and further left behind and you know obviously same in your country as same in mine record levels of unaffordability of the the basics housing education etc. So um sadly I think the answer here is yeah unless we really change things policy-wise yeah I think that's where we're headed. What are your thoughts? >> Well I I agree 100%. I mean I think look um the say we'll say a few things that maybe aren't as politically correct but I mean the reality is that I think the global agenda the Davos group the Davos crowd the world economic forum group um are I think have been promoting policies for the last decade couple decades that reward the few and at the expense of the many and uh they line the pockets of the super rich and they build these um again these build build these policies around um really almost a cultural Marxism which is what we've seen and it's interesting um that you were talking again with Matt Taibbe um about uh increasing view of Marxism or communism in America uh you see that through the um the mayor of New York and some of the young people just sort of throwing caution to the wind and saying okay free free enterprises and it's interesting and so you've had this increasing sort of growth of uh electing people who are really very very left. I mean, they're not just socialists, they're they're they're they're they're virtual Marxists. And that's a big concern. I think that is a byproduct though of um of exceptionally large large government that's become overbearing over the last number of decades and productivity going down and then offshoring our our manufacturing and so forth and the squashing of standards of living for the average person for the person on Main Street. And then you've had these uh attacks of uh as they say cultural Marxism, the DI, the DEI, the intersectionality, the you know putting different colors of people against each other, creating racial division. I mean it's just all of this stuff has created such disunityity in our culture and our economy and our society. And then you've had the complete breakdown of the family unit and the attack on the uh the traditional family unit. Um and all of these things go to breaking down um your uh class structure. And so um in terms of the the underclass becoming a permanent underclass in your economy and so these these are big issues, big concerns. I think the only way to reverse it um is to we must go back to a faith-based economy. We have to go back to a strong Christ our strong Christian roots which which is what underpinned all of Western civilization. the whole biblical understanding of righteousness, justice, bis biblical law and so forth. Um if we don't go back to that and then try to rebuild ourselves um and uh break down all these power structures that have been created uh in our economy um then we will not have a strong vibrant free market. We will have a one that's a neo feudalistic one where just a few people control um and uh they own all of the assets and you'll be h you'll own nothing and be happy type of thing. The only way to break that down is a complete reversal of what we've been doing the last number of decades and again I think that starts with uh personal faith convictions uh strong faith convictions um that will then build up from there into the strong family unit into building strong societies weakening the size of the government cutting the size of the state um the state is just way too large too intrusive and people have to take personal accountability and responsibility and if you don't work you don't eat these are basic principles um you if you try to get around those and you create a socialism and a stateism, it's only a matter of time before uh the uh u you have a a complete class divide. And so the only way to break that down is to reverse all of these policies. And if we don't uh I think the uh the person that wrote that question uh is dead on. We are going to go into a neofudal situation. >> All right. As you were talking, somebody said cultural Marxism, Jonathan, look no further than the Canadian federal government. I don't think you disagree with that, right? >> I agree 100%. Absolutely and 100%. And uh and we saw that with the Biden regime also in the United States. Uh again, fortunately, uh Trump, again, it's not perfect. I know he's got issues. Um but at least they're attempting to try to get that out of the system where we evaluate people on their merit and what they add to society. We try to treat people uh equally. Um we don't judge people by, you know, the color of their skin, but by the character, by their by their what they stand for, their virtues, uh who they are. um if we don't go back to that then we're going to let ourselves get attacked. That's what cultural Marxism does, right? It builds it wants to build disunityity and attack amongst the different groups in the society and wants to pit everybody against each other. And we can't build if we're fighting each other. We can only build together and build a great economy when we're communicating, talking, have open dialogue, and we're working together and we have respect for everybody. >> Yeah, I I can't agree more. Um, this has been creeping into more and more of my recent interviews. to sort of um it all comes down to values like what are what are the what are the foundational values that we can all agree on um so that we're not demonizing each other which is you know one of the one of the ways society seems to be devolving right now where um we we've we've broken into these factions where it's easy to to demonize the other and then um and then that begins to give you what I call the sort of false justification for inhuman acts and and you know that's we're seeing more and more of of of people reacting to their differences with violence that I think most Americans or most westerners would say hey that has no place at all in our society. So anyways, um folks, I just mentioned this because um you know, if if you'd like me to try to do a few more interviews in 2026, trying to really get to the root of like what are the values that we should all be uniting around to try to either build a better economy or build a better society. Um uh that's something I'm open to doing if there's there's demand here amongst the audience. All right. Oh, sorry, Jonathan. >> And I was just going to say those are all interrelated. So I think I would encourage you to uh to go go down that path. um Adam because you can't build a strong vibrant economy unless people are working together unless they share a common uh ideology and common views unless there's a common base upon which you're operating on. You have to have a rule of law and so forth. Um so when you start talking a little bit about the political area it's not just politics that's our economics too because if you don't have stability in your economy people are not going to be investing capital over the long term. So if you go down to you know the best place to go is just down say South America and you can look at the ups and downs down there in econ in governments uh you don't get this this consistent investment of capital which drives a compounding GDP over time and so it's critical that uh we are politically stable and we have free speech and people can communicate to each other and we can hold government accountable because whenever they step down a step on free speech this is why your first amendment is powerful and it's turning out in world that one of the only countries left where there's a relatively, you know, relatively uh large amount of free speech is the United States because you've got the first amendment. In Canada, we're seeing legislation being passed just as I'm speaking right now called C9, which is going to uh again limit our speech in our own country. But if you don't have free speech, a lot of times the reason the government's clamping down in that is they don't want you to expose what's going on in government. But if we can't expose what's going on in government and their spending and their policies and how they're driving the economy, taxation, all of this sort of stuff, it will also spill over to the economic front. It's unavoidable. So these these are all interlin. And so uh I think it's a topic that investors should be more concerned about what's going on in the political area because it will impact their pocketbooks. Don't fool yourself if you don't, you know, everything's been so stable in North America and many of the Western countries for many years. We just assume that that's what it's going to continue. But uh don't make that assumption. Uh there's a lot of changes going on. We need to protect our political uh systems and our democracies and our freedoms and especially freedom of speech and freedom of religion within our countries. >> Well, again very very well said Jonathan and uh you know for those that are familiar with concepts like the forth turning you know you were saying Jonathan look we we need to basically um reverse a lot of the policies that a lot of western countries have been going down. um the forth turning those you know the concept is that's where the status quo is kind of dismantled it breaks down it's then replaced with something um and it's not you know again it's like a season it's like winter you you you it is a healthy cycle to a certain extent um but you can't be just for tearing down right you you've got to to get into the for the first turning again the next first turning you have to determine what you're for right so you I want to make sure that we're doing our part not not just to point out the things that are wrong, but to start advocating for the things that are that are the better models to replace what we have right now. All right. Well, as we wrap things up here, Jonathan, thank you for again making time to do this with us on Christmas Eve day. Um, I'm sorry if I've been a little uh slowwitted during this conversation, doing my best just to fight through the fog inside my brain here with this darn cold. um for you know folks that are hoping to get 2026 off to a good start. Um and and in particular folks that live in Canada um and and would like to get some help from a good professional financial adviser. Um can you just talk for a second about if they just called you up and said, "Hey, Jonathan was listening to you on Thoughtful Money. Really like how you guys think." Um you know, if they reach out to you and I'll tell them how to do that in just a second. um uh what would the experience feel like uh with your team from from first call? >> Yeah, and we love people to contact us and we've had quite a large number of uh of listeners contact us from Thoughtful Money. So that happens on a regular basis and uh yeah, we take the call um talk to you, explain a little bit more about what we're doing. There's no pressure whatsoever from our perspective. And uh we will then uh look at your own portfolios and give you an analysis of where you now are positioned and whether you're comfortable with that, where we would make changes, where uh we see opportunities going forward and just work with the client uh to know them. Um understand their risk tolerances and how we can create an individualized uh portfolio for them that meets their long-term needs. It's very easy. Of course, when you're in the country with within Canada, if someone wants to if they have assets at a at a financial institution, um those are easily transferred over uh to another institution. Uh we are registered right across the country, all 10 provinces, and uh and would love to hear from anyone that uh is interested in just having a quick review of their portfolio, see where you stand and whether you're well positioned for 2026. >> All right. Well, two things folks. Um, first please thank join me in thanking Jonathan for coming on again um by hitting the like button and then if you haven't already clicking on the subscribe button below as well as that little bell icon right next to it. And um if you are living if you live in Canada and would like to talk to Jonathan and his team there at uh Rocklink um just fill out the very short form at thoughtfulmoney.com. Only takes you a couple seconds. be sure to say that you're a Canadian and you'll be matched with Jonathan and his team there. Uh if you're an American watching this, um just fill out the same form, tell us where you live, and we'll match you with one of the other financial advisors that Thoughtful Money endorses that are US-based, and these are the firms you see with me on this channel week in and week out. Uh they'd be happy to help you as well. Um Jonathan, um very much appreciate you doing this great discussion. Um, I'm really enjoying seeing people saying in the comments here uh a wishing you and me uh kind uh Christmas wishes, which is wonderful. Um, but some people saying, "Hey, this was a really good interview." And that's great because I am so cottonrained. I really had no clue how this this video was going. So, I'm glad I'm glad the the flu bug that's been going around is just been really severe and it just seems to hang around a long time. So, uh, praying that you get over it quickly, Adam, and doesn't interfere interfere too much with your Christmas celebrations with family. >> Thank you. Thank you. I'm on day four. I'm I'm going to bet that I'm turning a corner later today or tomorrow, hopefully. >> Yeah. >> You have to come down the Cayman and get some vitamin D naturally. >> Yeah. Be careful what you wish for. I might be there tomorrow, buddy. >> All right. Well, look, thanks so much, Jonathan, and everybody else. Thanks so much for watching. Again.