Why U.S. Retail Investors Are Finally Moving Into Gold And Silver
Summary
Precious Metals: The guest highlights a globally driven, physically led bull market in gold and silver, with shallow dips and new highs signaling a run on tangible assets.
Industrial Silver: Strong industrial demand, including battery applications and direct sourcing by manufacturers, is accelerating silver price gains and tightening supply.
Physical vs. Paper: A two-tiered market is evident with higher Chinese prices, COMEX inventory drawdowns, LBMA strains, and premiums rising due to a physical squeeze.
Hard Assets: The conversation frames a regime shift toward owning hard assets amid underinvestment in mining, limited capacity growth, and potential peak gold/silver dynamics.
De-dollarization: Trust erosion in fiat systems, dollar weaponization, BRICS’ gold-linked unit, and Japanese bond volatility are driving flows into precious metals as a hedge.
Market Structure: Interconnected global markets raise contagion risks, while tariffs and policy unpredictability are adding uncertainty that favors gold and silver.
Investor Behavior: Larger buyers are accumulating mint boxes while retail lags; supply delays persist but are manageable, and the outlook remains bullish for metals.
Transcript
Nothing in this program should be considered investment advice. It is for educational purposes only. Please hit pause and read this disclaimer in full. If you need silver in industry to make your products and you have, you know, what used to be a dollars worth of silver for an iPhone, now you need $5 worth of silver. You're going to pay a lot more to get that silver if you need it for your product. And that's really what this is all about. Hello everyone and welcome to this very special episode of FinanceU. We're covering of course gold and silver which have been telegraphing a lot of things to us not least of which is potentially something really big is brewing and to discuss that with us today back with us again Dana Samuelson he is the founder and president of American Gold Exchange and uh Dana so good to see you again. Uh, great to see you, Chris. Thanks for having me on. >> It's so good to have you back. Uh, so first off, Dana, you've been in the business decades. Um, and have you seen anything like this before? What what how does this compare to anything any other time you've seen in the gold and silver markets? >> No, this is off the charts. Uh, because we've never had a rally like this that's globally driven, absent problems in the US at the same time. And um the whole world is buying gold and silver uh hand over fist, but the US market doesn't seem to be except for maybe some bigger players. So very very wealthy uh who understand what's going on, but most average US investors I don't think really understand what's truly happening. Well, charts speak to me. Maybe they don't speak to everybody, but this is a monthly chart of gold starting in 2006 on the far left and coming up through here was that first big rise in 2011. Then of course it got consolidated they say and then it got driven back and it went nowhere for a whole decade. Um and then bounced here creating what chartist would call a cup and handle which is a thing. But look at this just sort of poked its head at 2000 for for years and then finally once it decided to go off off it's going that last part that explosive rise that we're seeing there in gold. We're seeing the same thing in silver, only perhaps more dramatically from a chart standpoint. Dana, this looks more to me like something that I think retail does not yet quite grasp that something really big is a foot here. And this is u potentially related to something you and I have talked about before, the mismanagement of a fiat money machine. Um coming to some sort of conclusion. Yes, it seems that debt is starting to really matter. Uh, you know, we're seeing a a a problem in the Japanese bond market today that's just kind of reared its ugly head out of nowhere. Uh, as the bond sales slipped and then all a sudden there was a lot of dumping of Japanese treasuries. Uh, and the bond yields have spiked. Now, what Japan only has a debt to GDP ratio of, you probably know a little bit better than I do, 252%. >> Something that's a little higher than that, but it's And we're at what 130 132 depending what numbers you look at. >> Yeah. >> This this feels like a grab for physical a run on the bank like we've never seen before for tangible assets. uh and when you see these these markets go parabolic and not really giving much up along the way that is a classic sign of a physical run and not a speculators you know leveraged paper market control of the market and that's what I've been saying for you know 6 8 10 months now is that this is a physically driven rally uh which is why I call it a land grab or a run on the bank of gold and silver uh that's why the corrections we've seen so far which would be more meaningful if leveraged paper traders were in control of the market would be more uh violent and more um volatile. Every time we've seen a little dip, it's been short and shallow and then we start moving higher again. Uh it's been truly remarkable. You know, obviously this traces back to a lot of things, but August 15th, 1971, we abandoned the gold standard. So that was that's a defa I consider that a default, right? The United States said, "Brettton Woods, we're gonna back gold dollars with gold at a rate of 35 to1." And then we said, "Nah." Threw in the towel on that. That's a default. Um, but I I look at these these charts like this and I think somebody else is worried about counterparty risk, default, yada yada. This is what would happen, I would predict, if well-advised, very wealthy people said, you know, I'd rather have a bird in the hand than two in the bush. I'd like to have me some physical because I'm worried about the solveny of the whole system. This is the kind of behavior I would expect. Uh that's exactly what you're seeing. And I think that, you know, the beach ball has slipped underwater grasp is exactly right. uh to see these markets run so hot especially for silver which has now doubled in you know a matter of months uh we've saw Samsung you know a year and you ago October in October of 2024 they said that they had this battery they were working on uh that will charge an EV in 9 minutes uh and it'll last 6 hours with a kilogram of silver in it instead of lithium I believe and now they've gone directly to Mexico to invest invest in a mine that was closed in Mexico to directly source the silver they want for these batteries themselves. And that's just a symptom of what's happening I think in this rush to get a hold of the metal that you need for industry which silver in particularly is needed for uh is happening that's why silver has made such u you know outsized gains compared to gold which is more neutral asset with less industry applications and platinum as well. >> Yeah. Well, well, gold is our monetary asset, but silver obviously huge industrial play, but it is starting to get some money-like quality sneaking back in with India's uh allowing it to be used as collateral for debts. That's the first remonetization, if you will, within a sovereign system that I'm aware of for silver. Um, but it but it's played a a money-like role traditionally, I would say, amongst a lot of Asian cultures for a long time. like they they value it because of its value um as a hedge or a store of wealth not as a industrial metal. Well, India in particular has been just an extremely aggressive buyers of silver over the last uh 6 months since Octo uh since August of 2025. um they've been importing record amounts of silver physically uh primarily for ETFs, but also for the population uh to to buy silver because of the collateralization that's going to go into effect in April of this year. Uh because gold has gotten, you know, such uh to such high price levels, it's become more expensive. Um and also because it's just much more affordable for them, right? and they value the currency aspect of it because India is one of the countries that suffered some of the worst inflation over the last two years. So if you held rupees or you held silver for the last year, you're way better off holding silver than you are holding Indian rupees. And that's why of all the major currencies uh the Indian rupee has seen the greatest depreciation against physical gold and silver over the last year than any other currency. Uh the last time I looked, which was a couple weeks ago, uh the US was just second. Yeah. Well, the United States is really good at regime change operations. Unfortunately, this time I think they're going to get us out of a regime of fiat paper um into anything else. And that could be a wide range of things I've just heard. So tin hits a record $51,000 a ton on the LME. Nickel plowing near near all-time highs except for that little spike they had recently. Gold, silver all-time highs. We're copper just off of its all-time highs. But but you can feel the pressure. So Dane, it kind of feels to me like, you know, the pendulum does swing. And for a while, people get all fascinated with paper, financialization, this and that, derivatives, private equity, it all sounds good. And then they wake up one day and they go, "Oh, we should own things." and the pendulum swings back over. Um, feels like we're in the middle of that regime shift from I can just hold everything in paper and it's going to be fine to maybe I ought to have some physical things over here. >> Yeah. Well, that speaks to the underinvestment in most of the mining around the world over the last 5 or 10 years because of this. So, there's no capacity to really ramp up a lot of mining to create more metal out of the ground. Uh, and that takes years to develop, of course. Uh, have we seen peak gold or peak silver? We may already have seen that. I'm not an expert on that, but I think the the world is realizing that there's more paper than there are, you know, tangible things to go around. And that's why we're getting price resets in all of these metals as uh the world is finally starting to do what China has been doing for 15 or 20 years you know starting in Africa which is to go in there and to you know develop natural resources so they have a supply chain uh which we of course have not done in fact and mining in the US is uh very difficult to do because of the e ecological laws right it's it's a dirty nasty business Um, so I I see a a rebalancing of pricing because the world is waking up to the fact that there is, you know, kind of a run on the bank and that we've underinvested in all of these sectors for years, uh, and potentially oil as well, which is why this is, you know, we're playing catch-up now as the world comes to the realization that, well, maybe we should do something a little different than we have been doing. >> Yeah. And and of course, this is something I've been looking at for for years and years, and it's interesting to watch it um come around, but it feels like it's happening. It's the pace of change that that's pretty extraordinary. Dana, we're going to take a quick break. Uh I want to hear from uh one of my favorite affiliates, and when we come back, we're going to talk about this what just happened in the Japanese bond market as a metaphor for everything else. It's really unbelievable. Hey folks, Chris Martinson here and I want to talk to you about having gold and silver in your portfolio and tell you who I personally use and recommend for when you are ready to buy gold, silver or other precious metals. Now, if you've been paying any attention at all, you know that both gold and silver have been increasing in price dramatically over the past year. Or rather, the dollar has been declining in value. Today, gold is more than $4,000 an ounce. A lot more. Or should we say that a dollar buys less than 1/4,000th of an ounce of gold? I don't know. You know, we could go either way. And I don't know what the right amount of gold and silver you should personally own. That's between you and your financial adviser. But I can tell you that the number is more than zero. Morgan Stanley now believes that number should be 20%. State Street Adviserss pegs it between 2 and 10%. Sprats Asset Management believes that a 10 to 15% waiting is correct, while Proactive Advisor Magazine's analysis recently found that up to a 35% waiting outperformed a traditionally balanced portfolio. Okay, so you've decided to pull the trigger and buy some gold and silver. Your next decision is incredibly important. Who do you use? For US customers, I strongly recommend American Gold Exchange or AE because I know and trust its founder and president, Dana Samuelson. First, Dana has decades of experience in all things related to precious metals, having founded American Gold Exchange in 1998. Second, American Gold Exchange has an unbelievably stellar 5.0 Trust Pilot rating based on 3,744 reviews. Third, I have no trouble believing that because I know Dana personally and he's as solid and as dependable as they come. Fourth, he'll help you make the right choices and understand the ins and outs, the ups and downs of any particular decision in times like these in particular. Deep experience is the most valuable commodity. By clicking on this link, you'll get both hold of Dana's firm and you'll be helping out Peak Prosperity because we have an affiliate relationship with Dana's firm. Full disclosure, whether you click that link or you just go to AG directly, you'll receive the same great prices and excellent service. But remember, you should not have a zero waiting to gold and silver. Thanks for listening. Now, back to our program. All right, welcome back everybody. Dana, um, you mentioned the Japanese bonds before. I think this is a perfect like fractal metaphor, even if you can call a whole nation a fractal, but this is astonishing to me. Uh, here we are, January 19th. I wake up this morning. Oh, 20th, sorry. This the 20th today. And I wake up this morning and I look at this and here are Japanese bonds. Look at these things. 6% increase in the yields on the Japanese 15-year, 6.37 on the 20, 7.8% on the 30. These are traded. Those are almost like penny stock moves, right? 5, six, seven, eight, nearly 8%. That should not be happening to the bonds of a sovereign nation. No, that is out. I mean, I've just was looking at this up this morning uh before we got on the air and this is astounding to see these kind of moves in one of the biggest credit markets in the world, which is the Japanese bond market. And this this is really very troubling to see. So it speaks to the idea that you know Japan may have a financial or a monetary accident but here's the thing that's bothered me for a long time Dana is that if you look at say the Japanese stock market the Nikkeay and you watch it trade during the day and their day is different than our day many time zones away but the futures for both the Japanese stock market and the US S&P trade almost tick fortick right and so it says that we don't have two separate markets we have one market Fine. Okay. But somebody in their infinite wisdom allowed that to sort of develop. That'd be the Federal Reserve and the regulatory apparatus. They wanted to have this one hive mind market, right? Great. But it's like I feel like we're sailing around in an old ship that has no bulkhead so that if if Japan's part of the hull gets pierced, I don't know that we can stop it from spreading here. And that's what I think is part of the risk that's getting priced in right now. What do you think? Uh, this brings to mind the Titanic. You know, the Titanic went down because it could only survive six bulkheads being torn into. And this feels like two or three bulkheads just got compromised >> and it could spread very easily. Like we're we might still be on the iceberg because uh of how tight the markets are intertwined. You know, the Fed became the backs stop for the whole world following the great financial crisis. And we saw that again to a degree in 20 uh 20. Um, and if they're forced to turn on the printing presses, that ignites this whole paper um, debt pile into an inferno. This is really really a troubling new development for the world's finances because if you don't trust the biggest credit markets in the world, what do you trust? Right? And that's what's really that's what really this is saying. >> This is why I've been such a critic of what the Federal Reserve has done. Um, obviously I don't I'm I'm critical for several levels. I I don't think they should be rewarding. It's not their job to reward one class of society at the expense of another. So that's a critique I have. But more importantly, they have one job and they have one product and their product is fictitious. It's printed out of nothing, you know, on hard disk. So their one job was to maintain trust and faith in that product. That's it. They had one thing to defend in their brand and they didn't do that. No, no. And they've rewarded bad behavior, too, right? By bailing out the banks during the great financial crisis. So, it's okay if you made a big foul against the public of the world, but we're going to fix your problem that you gave to us because we don't have a choice, >> right? And and they did the wrong thing. They should have let some of those banks fail, which would have created a bigger problem at the time, but we'd be better off for it now. Instead, we have a bigger problem. You know, Peter Schiff says over and over, they keep kicking the can down the road. Well, that can's gotten so big you can't hardly move it when you try and kick it now is the way uh this is shaping up. >> That's an interesting way to look at it. I I thought of them running on a road, but um certainly there's part of this that's hard to digest right now is watching Trump doing what he's doing. Well, let me back up. Watching what Biden did with using the Swift system and locking Russia's sovereign reserves, which were neither sovereign nor reserves. Um, and that of course undermined faith and trust. And then watching Trump do what he's doing in Greenland and in Venezuela and things like that. So on Grock this morning, this is how they put it. They, you know, Grock says, "Oh, gold tops 4750, silver hits 95 as Trump tariffs target Europe over Greenland." And so, you know, Trump announced these tariffs starting 10% February 1st against eight European nations. Um, France said, "Oh, we're not we're not going to join that thing." and Trump posited 200% tariffs on France. Just sort of like shooting from the hip, right? Um and Scott Patent, Treasury Secretary Scott Patent speaking in Davos called for calm and dismissed retaliation fears. I don't know if you heard this. This is extraordinary. The very short uh this like 19-second clip, but here's what Scott Bent says when he's asked, "You worried about anything Europe might do?" Just to follow on that, so you do not believe that the EU or the UK have any retaliatory financial instruments or measures in their bag that the United States should be worried about? >> No. >> It's one of the quietest nos I've ever heard. Pretty smug, right? >> No. >> Yeah. >> Yeah. I mean, this knee-jerk diplomacy, it's not diplomacy. This knee-jerk behavior by President Trump is I really think is what has sparked this fire under precious metals and other assets over the last year and a half now because of the uncertainty that he brings and you don't know what's coming next. You know, we kind of liked it when he took Madura out of Venezuela. That didn't create much of a ripple, but the Japanese bond marks market is creating a ripple today. and his obsession over Greenland, which I think is well founded uh because of the territorial uh access to the Arctic and the critical minerals that are, you know, probably under the ground there are are very key to the future of the US for the next 50, 100 years. But, you know, knee-jerking, I'm going to slap a 10% tariff on you because you're not playing ball. I mean, he's completely the bully in the room and the room's the whole world. And uh these are the kind of things that happen when that happens. >> Well, and these undermine that trust that's so important to the order of the system. So we're going to get a a new economic and financial order in the world whether we like it or not. That's part of the Mara Lago chords. They told us they were going to do this, they're doing it. We have to have faith, I guess, that they're going to do it well and elegantly. From the outside, it looks a little rough and tumble, but maybe there's more sophistication. I don't know about behind the scenes concern I have. What they're really doing is shaking up a system that's hundreds of years old and it's a complex system and I think there's a nonzero chance they just muck it up and break things that are very hard to put back together once you break them like diplomatic relationships. >> Right? We saw that to a degree during the first Trump presidency when he ratcheted up tariffs back then which are obviously much more mild than the everything he's doing right now. uh which is what caused China to you know seek other alternatives to US treasuries and investments at the time and now with the Biden weaponizing um the dollar and the banking system uh for uh Russia's invasion of the Ukraine. I mean, Russia didn't want to create a whole new banking transfer system, but they were forced to, right? And now the the bricks have a the unit, their currency unit is backed 40% by gold. And that is a brand new revelation just in the last month or two, which has, you know, big implications for gold going higher in the future. Uh, I mean, he truly has created a lot of uncertainty is the best word to describe it. and he's not stopping. It's going to continue. >> Well, one of the effects of this, Dana, that I'd love to get your insights into cuz um it feels like there's free money to be made here. And I'm talking about the the delta between silver priced in at the comx and in Shanghai. And I don't understand how a 9101 difference per ounce exists between those two markets. That should be arbitrageed away. It feels fairly simple for somebody in your position that's to order up a few thousand ounce bars and sell forward a SHF contract and uh in in China and deliver in a month. I mean, what what is what markets? This is such a dislocation in markets. I'm wondering how you're interpreting this from your from your experience standpoint. >> Well, this is this is something that's been going on for years. actually when silver was 14 or $15 an ounce. One of my colleagues was actually having the China Mint make coins for him uh for use in the US and he could either import his own silver or he could buy it in China for 17 or $18 an ounce which was a spread of about 20% at the time, right? Uh only the biggest players can play the arbitrage that you just described, right? Because you've got to be able to handle the logistics, the customs, the financing, take the risk. Uh but clearly the Chinese are putting a bigger floor under silver and putting a higher value on it than the rest of the world right now is and that's very telling. Uh they don't do these kind of things lightly and if the market's worth that much more which it is. Uh that is the Chinese saying this is what we'll pay for it. So we have a a two-tiered market right now. If you can bring it into China you can get you can harvest that. And believe me, some of that has to be happening with the biggest bullion banks right now. Uh so I'll keep a close eye on how much silver remains in the COMX warehouses, which is still abnormally high u compared to what we've had for an average amount of silver uh over the last 20 years um due to fears over tariffs earlier this year. But that that silver which got to like 431 million ounces is down to about 340 million ounces now and it's migrating out and typically we've had about 200,000 ounces and we've already seen strains in the London Bullion Market Association physical silver which is why this is just a physical grab. That's really what this is all about. It points all the all the uh indicators all point back to the same thing physical >> physical. So, let's talk domestic physical because we've all seen the headlines. The mint suspends sales for a while. Um, I go on to random websites, you know, uh, of gold dealers just to see what they have. We're down to some pretty, I'll call it, peripheral products on in some cases, you know. So, what are you experiencing from a supply standpoint? >> Well, we are in a squeeze and we've been here uh, three times in the past 15 16 years. Uh we got into one during the great financial crisis again when COVID hit and then the Reddit kids came after us with the silver market in 2022 if I remember correctly. And each of those times we got into a a situation where demand exceeded the ability of the mints around the world to produce products. So, we got into a situation where the the biggest players in the market, the mint distributors, gamed out what they expected the mints to deliver to them uh and how far out that they could sell product relying on what the mints could provide them with, you know, a week from now, two weeks from now, four weeks from now. Uh we even got into a point where we were eight weeks forward delivery and pricing products today, but for delivery in six or eight weeks, we're in one of those situations now, but it's not as acute. We're about 3 weeks out for delayed delivery, and premiums are about a dollar to $2 an ounce higher than they should be because of the squeeze, but it's not abnormal yet. And the higher silver price is bringing a lot of sellers out as well. So, we're we're supplying ourselves to a degree without having to go to the mints, which is helping to supplement what could be a greater squeeze. Uh because most US investors, you know, they've they've seen their silver double or triple in the last, you know, 10 years, 15 years, and they're harvesting some of those profits because they don't understand what's really going on. They bought it for a reason, but maybe the reason they're holding it has changed. Some people are just aging out and some people just want the profits. But I I would not be a seller at this point in time because I think we still have, you know, quite a substantial u gains ahead of us the way this whole world is going. Interesting. Um and any are you noticing any difference in um in the composition of buyers or sellers in terms of like are these higher volume? I mean, you know, more wealthier people doing bigger purchases or uh what's the structure look like right now? >> Yeah, we're selling more mint boxes right now than we have sold for a long time. Uh people want bulk and they like the 1 coins because of the potential convertability of them in the future. That's, you know, hard money in a crisis. So, we're selling a lot of mint boxes. uh you know, we're getting some small orders, but the the the average retail buyer in the US is really not in the market right now. That's why I say bigger money's playing, but uh you know, the average guy is is really not they get it. Some of them get it, but they're not buying as much as they could or would if we have a real uh apparent problem like they're starting to see in Japan right now. >> Interesting. And I' I've seen uh yeah, there are shortages here and there around the world, but it just speaks that there's been a sort of a physical grab at this point in time. Um >> yeah, we kind of wipe the shelves clean of all the available, you know, for media delivery product absent what comes in over the counter right now. >> Yeah. And it's I mean it's just this is an important point, right? I've learned this multiple times. You mentioned those moments where we find out that the there's plenty of silver until there isn't and you find out just how thin that silver pipeline is. It's tiny. It's It's small. >> Yeah, it is. It is. And this is where the rubber's meeting the road. That's why we've had such a sharp price increase. If there was a lot of silver to go around, it wouldn't be $95 an ounce, which it hit today, new alltime high. It'd be $50 an ounce or maybe $60 an ounce, depending with the way everything's gone. And the potential for it to go higher, I think, is still very, very good. You know, it could be that the world thinks that there's a floor that they ought to buy silver up to. I've heard this, you know, bandied about some of the chat rooms that, you know, they're going to buy silver up to 100 or 120 or 125 and then they'll put a put a floor under it at that number, right? So, we'll see how it how to how it shakes out. But if you need silver in industry to make your products and you have, you know, what used to be a dollars worth of silver for an iPhone, now you need $5 worth of silver, you're going to pay a lot more to get that silver if you need it for your product. And that's really what this is all about. Yeah. And I've heard about um you mentioned Samsung in Mexico. I heard about China and India both had firms that approached a Canadian mine to say we'll pay X dollars above spot um just to just to lock in supply and and so as we look at that after the post Biden weaponization of the dollar for geopolitical purposes I think the phrase has to be updated I think the phrase is now possession is teten of the law that's perfect and that's a great uh point you made about China and India both going to the Canadian Mint to again direct source metal because there are good mines in uh gold and silver mines in Canada. Now I don't know how what the longevity of them is relative to the demand or the depth of the u metal in the ground is but that's a great point and yes possession is now 10 of the law that's really what this means that that last tenth just got squeezed out. Well everybody, we've been talking with Dana Samson of American Gold Exchange and uh they are an affiliate of Peak Prosperity and we love working with them because Dana knows his business, high integrity and uh has has just always done the right thing for anybody who chooses to work with him. But everybody should not be selling Graham silver. Maybe holding on to it for a bit longer here would be my non-financial advice at this stage. Yeah, I I I I think uh having some gold and silver is a is a good thing for everybody. So, thank you, Chris. I really appreciate it. And we love working with Peak Prosperity. Wonderful, wonderful team. And you are obviously are a brilliant man and we love everything that you do for us. So, thank you. Thank you, Dana. Right back at you. All right, everybody. Until next time, please keep your eyes on the markets. Uh big things are happening. Till next time, I'm Chris Martinson. See you later. Bye.
Why U.S. Retail Investors Are Finally Moving Into Gold And Silver
Summary
Transcript
Nothing in this program should be considered investment advice. It is for educational purposes only. Please hit pause and read this disclaimer in full. If you need silver in industry to make your products and you have, you know, what used to be a dollars worth of silver for an iPhone, now you need $5 worth of silver. You're going to pay a lot more to get that silver if you need it for your product. And that's really what this is all about. Hello everyone and welcome to this very special episode of FinanceU. We're covering of course gold and silver which have been telegraphing a lot of things to us not least of which is potentially something really big is brewing and to discuss that with us today back with us again Dana Samuelson he is the founder and president of American Gold Exchange and uh Dana so good to see you again. Uh, great to see you, Chris. Thanks for having me on. >> It's so good to have you back. Uh, so first off, Dana, you've been in the business decades. Um, and have you seen anything like this before? What what how does this compare to anything any other time you've seen in the gold and silver markets? >> No, this is off the charts. Uh, because we've never had a rally like this that's globally driven, absent problems in the US at the same time. And um the whole world is buying gold and silver uh hand over fist, but the US market doesn't seem to be except for maybe some bigger players. So very very wealthy uh who understand what's going on, but most average US investors I don't think really understand what's truly happening. Well, charts speak to me. Maybe they don't speak to everybody, but this is a monthly chart of gold starting in 2006 on the far left and coming up through here was that first big rise in 2011. Then of course it got consolidated they say and then it got driven back and it went nowhere for a whole decade. Um and then bounced here creating what chartist would call a cup and handle which is a thing. But look at this just sort of poked its head at 2000 for for years and then finally once it decided to go off off it's going that last part that explosive rise that we're seeing there in gold. We're seeing the same thing in silver, only perhaps more dramatically from a chart standpoint. Dana, this looks more to me like something that I think retail does not yet quite grasp that something really big is a foot here. And this is u potentially related to something you and I have talked about before, the mismanagement of a fiat money machine. Um coming to some sort of conclusion. Yes, it seems that debt is starting to really matter. Uh, you know, we're seeing a a a problem in the Japanese bond market today that's just kind of reared its ugly head out of nowhere. Uh, as the bond sales slipped and then all a sudden there was a lot of dumping of Japanese treasuries. Uh, and the bond yields have spiked. Now, what Japan only has a debt to GDP ratio of, you probably know a little bit better than I do, 252%. >> Something that's a little higher than that, but it's And we're at what 130 132 depending what numbers you look at. >> Yeah. >> This this feels like a grab for physical a run on the bank like we've never seen before for tangible assets. uh and when you see these these markets go parabolic and not really giving much up along the way that is a classic sign of a physical run and not a speculators you know leveraged paper market control of the market and that's what I've been saying for you know 6 8 10 months now is that this is a physically driven rally uh which is why I call it a land grab or a run on the bank of gold and silver uh that's why the corrections we've seen so far which would be more meaningful if leveraged paper traders were in control of the market would be more uh violent and more um volatile. Every time we've seen a little dip, it's been short and shallow and then we start moving higher again. Uh it's been truly remarkable. You know, obviously this traces back to a lot of things, but August 15th, 1971, we abandoned the gold standard. So that was that's a defa I consider that a default, right? The United States said, "Brettton Woods, we're gonna back gold dollars with gold at a rate of 35 to1." And then we said, "Nah." Threw in the towel on that. That's a default. Um, but I I look at these these charts like this and I think somebody else is worried about counterparty risk, default, yada yada. This is what would happen, I would predict, if well-advised, very wealthy people said, you know, I'd rather have a bird in the hand than two in the bush. I'd like to have me some physical because I'm worried about the solveny of the whole system. This is the kind of behavior I would expect. Uh that's exactly what you're seeing. And I think that, you know, the beach ball has slipped underwater grasp is exactly right. uh to see these markets run so hot especially for silver which has now doubled in you know a matter of months uh we've saw Samsung you know a year and you ago October in October of 2024 they said that they had this battery they were working on uh that will charge an EV in 9 minutes uh and it'll last 6 hours with a kilogram of silver in it instead of lithium I believe and now they've gone directly to Mexico to invest invest in a mine that was closed in Mexico to directly source the silver they want for these batteries themselves. And that's just a symptom of what's happening I think in this rush to get a hold of the metal that you need for industry which silver in particularly is needed for uh is happening that's why silver has made such u you know outsized gains compared to gold which is more neutral asset with less industry applications and platinum as well. >> Yeah. Well, well, gold is our monetary asset, but silver obviously huge industrial play, but it is starting to get some money-like quality sneaking back in with India's uh allowing it to be used as collateral for debts. That's the first remonetization, if you will, within a sovereign system that I'm aware of for silver. Um, but it but it's played a a money-like role traditionally, I would say, amongst a lot of Asian cultures for a long time. like they they value it because of its value um as a hedge or a store of wealth not as a industrial metal. Well, India in particular has been just an extremely aggressive buyers of silver over the last uh 6 months since Octo uh since August of 2025. um they've been importing record amounts of silver physically uh primarily for ETFs, but also for the population uh to to buy silver because of the collateralization that's going to go into effect in April of this year. Uh because gold has gotten, you know, such uh to such high price levels, it's become more expensive. Um and also because it's just much more affordable for them, right? and they value the currency aspect of it because India is one of the countries that suffered some of the worst inflation over the last two years. So if you held rupees or you held silver for the last year, you're way better off holding silver than you are holding Indian rupees. And that's why of all the major currencies uh the Indian rupee has seen the greatest depreciation against physical gold and silver over the last year than any other currency. Uh the last time I looked, which was a couple weeks ago, uh the US was just second. Yeah. Well, the United States is really good at regime change operations. Unfortunately, this time I think they're going to get us out of a regime of fiat paper um into anything else. And that could be a wide range of things I've just heard. So tin hits a record $51,000 a ton on the LME. Nickel plowing near near all-time highs except for that little spike they had recently. Gold, silver all-time highs. We're copper just off of its all-time highs. But but you can feel the pressure. So Dane, it kind of feels to me like, you know, the pendulum does swing. And for a while, people get all fascinated with paper, financialization, this and that, derivatives, private equity, it all sounds good. And then they wake up one day and they go, "Oh, we should own things." and the pendulum swings back over. Um, feels like we're in the middle of that regime shift from I can just hold everything in paper and it's going to be fine to maybe I ought to have some physical things over here. >> Yeah. Well, that speaks to the underinvestment in most of the mining around the world over the last 5 or 10 years because of this. So, there's no capacity to really ramp up a lot of mining to create more metal out of the ground. Uh, and that takes years to develop, of course. Uh, have we seen peak gold or peak silver? We may already have seen that. I'm not an expert on that, but I think the the world is realizing that there's more paper than there are, you know, tangible things to go around. And that's why we're getting price resets in all of these metals as uh the world is finally starting to do what China has been doing for 15 or 20 years you know starting in Africa which is to go in there and to you know develop natural resources so they have a supply chain uh which we of course have not done in fact and mining in the US is uh very difficult to do because of the e ecological laws right it's it's a dirty nasty business Um, so I I see a a rebalancing of pricing because the world is waking up to the fact that there is, you know, kind of a run on the bank and that we've underinvested in all of these sectors for years, uh, and potentially oil as well, which is why this is, you know, we're playing catch-up now as the world comes to the realization that, well, maybe we should do something a little different than we have been doing. >> Yeah. And and of course, this is something I've been looking at for for years and years, and it's interesting to watch it um come around, but it feels like it's happening. It's the pace of change that that's pretty extraordinary. Dana, we're going to take a quick break. Uh I want to hear from uh one of my favorite affiliates, and when we come back, we're going to talk about this what just happened in the Japanese bond market as a metaphor for everything else. It's really unbelievable. Hey folks, Chris Martinson here and I want to talk to you about having gold and silver in your portfolio and tell you who I personally use and recommend for when you are ready to buy gold, silver or other precious metals. Now, if you've been paying any attention at all, you know that both gold and silver have been increasing in price dramatically over the past year. Or rather, the dollar has been declining in value. Today, gold is more than $4,000 an ounce. A lot more. Or should we say that a dollar buys less than 1/4,000th of an ounce of gold? I don't know. You know, we could go either way. And I don't know what the right amount of gold and silver you should personally own. That's between you and your financial adviser. But I can tell you that the number is more than zero. Morgan Stanley now believes that number should be 20%. State Street Adviserss pegs it between 2 and 10%. Sprats Asset Management believes that a 10 to 15% waiting is correct, while Proactive Advisor Magazine's analysis recently found that up to a 35% waiting outperformed a traditionally balanced portfolio. Okay, so you've decided to pull the trigger and buy some gold and silver. Your next decision is incredibly important. Who do you use? For US customers, I strongly recommend American Gold Exchange or AE because I know and trust its founder and president, Dana Samuelson. First, Dana has decades of experience in all things related to precious metals, having founded American Gold Exchange in 1998. Second, American Gold Exchange has an unbelievably stellar 5.0 Trust Pilot rating based on 3,744 reviews. Third, I have no trouble believing that because I know Dana personally and he's as solid and as dependable as they come. Fourth, he'll help you make the right choices and understand the ins and outs, the ups and downs of any particular decision in times like these in particular. Deep experience is the most valuable commodity. By clicking on this link, you'll get both hold of Dana's firm and you'll be helping out Peak Prosperity because we have an affiliate relationship with Dana's firm. Full disclosure, whether you click that link or you just go to AG directly, you'll receive the same great prices and excellent service. But remember, you should not have a zero waiting to gold and silver. Thanks for listening. Now, back to our program. All right, welcome back everybody. Dana, um, you mentioned the Japanese bonds before. I think this is a perfect like fractal metaphor, even if you can call a whole nation a fractal, but this is astonishing to me. Uh, here we are, January 19th. I wake up this morning. Oh, 20th, sorry. This the 20th today. And I wake up this morning and I look at this and here are Japanese bonds. Look at these things. 6% increase in the yields on the Japanese 15-year, 6.37 on the 20, 7.8% on the 30. These are traded. Those are almost like penny stock moves, right? 5, six, seven, eight, nearly 8%. That should not be happening to the bonds of a sovereign nation. No, that is out. I mean, I've just was looking at this up this morning uh before we got on the air and this is astounding to see these kind of moves in one of the biggest credit markets in the world, which is the Japanese bond market. And this this is really very troubling to see. So it speaks to the idea that you know Japan may have a financial or a monetary accident but here's the thing that's bothered me for a long time Dana is that if you look at say the Japanese stock market the Nikkeay and you watch it trade during the day and their day is different than our day many time zones away but the futures for both the Japanese stock market and the US S&P trade almost tick fortick right and so it says that we don't have two separate markets we have one market Fine. Okay. But somebody in their infinite wisdom allowed that to sort of develop. That'd be the Federal Reserve and the regulatory apparatus. They wanted to have this one hive mind market, right? Great. But it's like I feel like we're sailing around in an old ship that has no bulkhead so that if if Japan's part of the hull gets pierced, I don't know that we can stop it from spreading here. And that's what I think is part of the risk that's getting priced in right now. What do you think? Uh, this brings to mind the Titanic. You know, the Titanic went down because it could only survive six bulkheads being torn into. And this feels like two or three bulkheads just got compromised >> and it could spread very easily. Like we're we might still be on the iceberg because uh of how tight the markets are intertwined. You know, the Fed became the backs stop for the whole world following the great financial crisis. And we saw that again to a degree in 20 uh 20. Um, and if they're forced to turn on the printing presses, that ignites this whole paper um, debt pile into an inferno. This is really really a troubling new development for the world's finances because if you don't trust the biggest credit markets in the world, what do you trust? Right? And that's what's really that's what really this is saying. >> This is why I've been such a critic of what the Federal Reserve has done. Um, obviously I don't I'm I'm critical for several levels. I I don't think they should be rewarding. It's not their job to reward one class of society at the expense of another. So that's a critique I have. But more importantly, they have one job and they have one product and their product is fictitious. It's printed out of nothing, you know, on hard disk. So their one job was to maintain trust and faith in that product. That's it. They had one thing to defend in their brand and they didn't do that. No, no. And they've rewarded bad behavior, too, right? By bailing out the banks during the great financial crisis. So, it's okay if you made a big foul against the public of the world, but we're going to fix your problem that you gave to us because we don't have a choice, >> right? And and they did the wrong thing. They should have let some of those banks fail, which would have created a bigger problem at the time, but we'd be better off for it now. Instead, we have a bigger problem. You know, Peter Schiff says over and over, they keep kicking the can down the road. Well, that can's gotten so big you can't hardly move it when you try and kick it now is the way uh this is shaping up. >> That's an interesting way to look at it. I I thought of them running on a road, but um certainly there's part of this that's hard to digest right now is watching Trump doing what he's doing. Well, let me back up. Watching what Biden did with using the Swift system and locking Russia's sovereign reserves, which were neither sovereign nor reserves. Um, and that of course undermined faith and trust. And then watching Trump do what he's doing in Greenland and in Venezuela and things like that. So on Grock this morning, this is how they put it. They, you know, Grock says, "Oh, gold tops 4750, silver hits 95 as Trump tariffs target Europe over Greenland." And so, you know, Trump announced these tariffs starting 10% February 1st against eight European nations. Um, France said, "Oh, we're not we're not going to join that thing." and Trump posited 200% tariffs on France. Just sort of like shooting from the hip, right? Um and Scott Patent, Treasury Secretary Scott Patent speaking in Davos called for calm and dismissed retaliation fears. I don't know if you heard this. This is extraordinary. The very short uh this like 19-second clip, but here's what Scott Bent says when he's asked, "You worried about anything Europe might do?" Just to follow on that, so you do not believe that the EU or the UK have any retaliatory financial instruments or measures in their bag that the United States should be worried about? >> No. >> It's one of the quietest nos I've ever heard. Pretty smug, right? >> No. >> Yeah. >> Yeah. I mean, this knee-jerk diplomacy, it's not diplomacy. This knee-jerk behavior by President Trump is I really think is what has sparked this fire under precious metals and other assets over the last year and a half now because of the uncertainty that he brings and you don't know what's coming next. You know, we kind of liked it when he took Madura out of Venezuela. That didn't create much of a ripple, but the Japanese bond marks market is creating a ripple today. and his obsession over Greenland, which I think is well founded uh because of the territorial uh access to the Arctic and the critical minerals that are, you know, probably under the ground there are are very key to the future of the US for the next 50, 100 years. But, you know, knee-jerking, I'm going to slap a 10% tariff on you because you're not playing ball. I mean, he's completely the bully in the room and the room's the whole world. And uh these are the kind of things that happen when that happens. >> Well, and these undermine that trust that's so important to the order of the system. So we're going to get a a new economic and financial order in the world whether we like it or not. That's part of the Mara Lago chords. They told us they were going to do this, they're doing it. We have to have faith, I guess, that they're going to do it well and elegantly. From the outside, it looks a little rough and tumble, but maybe there's more sophistication. I don't know about behind the scenes concern I have. What they're really doing is shaking up a system that's hundreds of years old and it's a complex system and I think there's a nonzero chance they just muck it up and break things that are very hard to put back together once you break them like diplomatic relationships. >> Right? We saw that to a degree during the first Trump presidency when he ratcheted up tariffs back then which are obviously much more mild than the everything he's doing right now. uh which is what caused China to you know seek other alternatives to US treasuries and investments at the time and now with the Biden weaponizing um the dollar and the banking system uh for uh Russia's invasion of the Ukraine. I mean, Russia didn't want to create a whole new banking transfer system, but they were forced to, right? And now the the bricks have a the unit, their currency unit is backed 40% by gold. And that is a brand new revelation just in the last month or two, which has, you know, big implications for gold going higher in the future. Uh, I mean, he truly has created a lot of uncertainty is the best word to describe it. and he's not stopping. It's going to continue. >> Well, one of the effects of this, Dana, that I'd love to get your insights into cuz um it feels like there's free money to be made here. And I'm talking about the the delta between silver priced in at the comx and in Shanghai. And I don't understand how a 9101 difference per ounce exists between those two markets. That should be arbitrageed away. It feels fairly simple for somebody in your position that's to order up a few thousand ounce bars and sell forward a SHF contract and uh in in China and deliver in a month. I mean, what what is what markets? This is such a dislocation in markets. I'm wondering how you're interpreting this from your from your experience standpoint. >> Well, this is this is something that's been going on for years. actually when silver was 14 or $15 an ounce. One of my colleagues was actually having the China Mint make coins for him uh for use in the US and he could either import his own silver or he could buy it in China for 17 or $18 an ounce which was a spread of about 20% at the time, right? Uh only the biggest players can play the arbitrage that you just described, right? Because you've got to be able to handle the logistics, the customs, the financing, take the risk. Uh but clearly the Chinese are putting a bigger floor under silver and putting a higher value on it than the rest of the world right now is and that's very telling. Uh they don't do these kind of things lightly and if the market's worth that much more which it is. Uh that is the Chinese saying this is what we'll pay for it. So we have a a two-tiered market right now. If you can bring it into China you can get you can harvest that. And believe me, some of that has to be happening with the biggest bullion banks right now. Uh so I'll keep a close eye on how much silver remains in the COMX warehouses, which is still abnormally high u compared to what we've had for an average amount of silver uh over the last 20 years um due to fears over tariffs earlier this year. But that that silver which got to like 431 million ounces is down to about 340 million ounces now and it's migrating out and typically we've had about 200,000 ounces and we've already seen strains in the London Bullion Market Association physical silver which is why this is just a physical grab. That's really what this is all about. It points all the all the uh indicators all point back to the same thing physical >> physical. So, let's talk domestic physical because we've all seen the headlines. The mint suspends sales for a while. Um, I go on to random websites, you know, uh, of gold dealers just to see what they have. We're down to some pretty, I'll call it, peripheral products on in some cases, you know. So, what are you experiencing from a supply standpoint? >> Well, we are in a squeeze and we've been here uh, three times in the past 15 16 years. Uh we got into one during the great financial crisis again when COVID hit and then the Reddit kids came after us with the silver market in 2022 if I remember correctly. And each of those times we got into a a situation where demand exceeded the ability of the mints around the world to produce products. So, we got into a situation where the the biggest players in the market, the mint distributors, gamed out what they expected the mints to deliver to them uh and how far out that they could sell product relying on what the mints could provide them with, you know, a week from now, two weeks from now, four weeks from now. Uh we even got into a point where we were eight weeks forward delivery and pricing products today, but for delivery in six or eight weeks, we're in one of those situations now, but it's not as acute. We're about 3 weeks out for delayed delivery, and premiums are about a dollar to $2 an ounce higher than they should be because of the squeeze, but it's not abnormal yet. And the higher silver price is bringing a lot of sellers out as well. So, we're we're supplying ourselves to a degree without having to go to the mints, which is helping to supplement what could be a greater squeeze. Uh because most US investors, you know, they've they've seen their silver double or triple in the last, you know, 10 years, 15 years, and they're harvesting some of those profits because they don't understand what's really going on. They bought it for a reason, but maybe the reason they're holding it has changed. Some people are just aging out and some people just want the profits. But I I would not be a seller at this point in time because I think we still have, you know, quite a substantial u gains ahead of us the way this whole world is going. Interesting. Um and any are you noticing any difference in um in the composition of buyers or sellers in terms of like are these higher volume? I mean, you know, more wealthier people doing bigger purchases or uh what's the structure look like right now? >> Yeah, we're selling more mint boxes right now than we have sold for a long time. Uh people want bulk and they like the 1 coins because of the potential convertability of them in the future. That's, you know, hard money in a crisis. So, we're selling a lot of mint boxes. uh you know, we're getting some small orders, but the the the average retail buyer in the US is really not in the market right now. That's why I say bigger money's playing, but uh you know, the average guy is is really not they get it. Some of them get it, but they're not buying as much as they could or would if we have a real uh apparent problem like they're starting to see in Japan right now. >> Interesting. And I' I've seen uh yeah, there are shortages here and there around the world, but it just speaks that there's been a sort of a physical grab at this point in time. Um >> yeah, we kind of wipe the shelves clean of all the available, you know, for media delivery product absent what comes in over the counter right now. >> Yeah. And it's I mean it's just this is an important point, right? I've learned this multiple times. You mentioned those moments where we find out that the there's plenty of silver until there isn't and you find out just how thin that silver pipeline is. It's tiny. It's It's small. >> Yeah, it is. It is. And this is where the rubber's meeting the road. That's why we've had such a sharp price increase. If there was a lot of silver to go around, it wouldn't be $95 an ounce, which it hit today, new alltime high. It'd be $50 an ounce or maybe $60 an ounce, depending with the way everything's gone. And the potential for it to go higher, I think, is still very, very good. You know, it could be that the world thinks that there's a floor that they ought to buy silver up to. I've heard this, you know, bandied about some of the chat rooms that, you know, they're going to buy silver up to 100 or 120 or 125 and then they'll put a put a floor under it at that number, right? So, we'll see how it how to how it shakes out. But if you need silver in industry to make your products and you have, you know, what used to be a dollars worth of silver for an iPhone, now you need $5 worth of silver, you're going to pay a lot more to get that silver if you need it for your product. And that's really what this is all about. Yeah. And I've heard about um you mentioned Samsung in Mexico. I heard about China and India both had firms that approached a Canadian mine to say we'll pay X dollars above spot um just to just to lock in supply and and so as we look at that after the post Biden weaponization of the dollar for geopolitical purposes I think the phrase has to be updated I think the phrase is now possession is teten of the law that's perfect and that's a great uh point you made about China and India both going to the Canadian Mint to again direct source metal because there are good mines in uh gold and silver mines in Canada. Now I don't know how what the longevity of them is relative to the demand or the depth of the u metal in the ground is but that's a great point and yes possession is now 10 of the law that's really what this means that that last tenth just got squeezed out. Well everybody, we've been talking with Dana Samson of American Gold Exchange and uh they are an affiliate of Peak Prosperity and we love working with them because Dana knows his business, high integrity and uh has has just always done the right thing for anybody who chooses to work with him. But everybody should not be selling Graham silver. Maybe holding on to it for a bit longer here would be my non-financial advice at this stage. Yeah, I I I I think uh having some gold and silver is a is a good thing for everybody. So, thank you, Chris. I really appreciate it. And we love working with Peak Prosperity. Wonderful, wonderful team. And you are obviously are a brilliant man and we love everything that you do for us. So, thank you. Thank you, Dana. Right back at you. All right, everybody. Until next time, please keep your eyes on the markets. Uh big things are happening. Till next time, I'm Chris Martinson. See you later. Bye.