Pitch Summary:
DSM-Firmenich has recently sold its ANH unit for €2.2 billion plus a €0.5 billion earn-out, aligning with market expectations. Despite the market’s lukewarm reaction, this divestment significantly alters the company’s financial profile, positioning it for more growth, higher margins, and increased pricing power. The current cyclical headwinds have depressed the share price, presenting a potential buying opportunity. An upcoming investor day in March is anticipated to present a bullish narrative, potentially acting as a catalyst for the stock.

BSD Analysis:
The divestment of the ANH unit allows DSM-Firmenich to focus on its core growth areas, enhancing its financial flexibility and operational efficiency. The market’s initial negative reaction may be short-lived as investors digest the long-term benefits of the transaction. The company’s strategic shift towards higher-margin segments could improve its competitive positioning and resilience against economic cycles. The upcoming investor day is expected to provide further insights into the company’s growth strategy, potentially boosting investor confidence and stock performance. Monitoring the company’s execution on its growth initiatives will be crucial for assessing its future prospects.

Description:
To get 5% off of your CoolWallet purchase, use my link: https://www.coolwallet.io/discount/davidcw John Wu, President of Ava …

Transcript:
We are a fractional reserve system. If all of a sudden everyone can create stable coins, you know, in some sense, the Fed and the government lose control of the economy. The new investors, they like to see the high volatility. They are looking at AI stocks, robotic stocks. They’re looking at commodities that recently have gone crazy and they’re competing with prediction markets. If you are an individual investor and you’re willing to do the homework and you can stomach the the volatility, this is an unbelievable time to be an investor. I’m very pleased to welcome to the program John Wu, president at Ava Labs. Avalanche that the Avalanche network is a layer 1 blockchain used for building a lot of decentralized apps. The uh native token AVAC is one of the largest cryptos uh by market cap in the top 20 to 30 depending on the day. So very pleased to welcome Don John to the show. who’s going to be talking to us about the future of tech and the future of crypto. Welcome back to the show. Well, welcome to the show. I I I keep saying that because it feels like we’ve talked before and we have. I’ve known you for a long time. >> Many times, but first time on the show and it’s great to see you. >> You’re very thoughtful in this great success. >> Thank you very much. I appreciate it. Um, you’ve served uh on the investment side before the crypto side. So, let’s just talk about the crypto landscape right now from an investor standpoint. This this correction uh this bare market, whatever you want to call it. Bitcoin having now corrected from $120,000 to 67,000, so 40 50%. We have firms like strategy, Michael Sale, Strategy down a lot more than 50% over the course of 2025. It feels like a lull. It feels like a bare market. So, as somebody who spent years working on Wall Street on the investment side, does this feel like a healthy correction to you or is this the beginning of something worse for the crypto market? I think that’s what a lot of investors are trying to figure out right now. How would you go about trying to figure that out yourself? >> Well, like all emerging trends, they go through stages. And generally speaking, I think crypto is still relatively early, but it is going through one paradigm shift to another. And what I mean by that is we’ve seen a lot happen now in terms of regulation and there is definitely a lot of adoption uh in many forms but what’s happening now is there’s a shift from the old guard to what I would call the new guard and it’s not just at the investor level it’s also the type of developer I see it in the people we’re trying to hire at Ava Labs it’s also in the user level different types of users are trying to experiment in the space more institutional in many respects. You know, the way I think about it is um blockchain when I first got in was pretty much personified as crypto assets. Today, it’s becoming more and more enterprise technology. You have New York Stock Exchange looking to build on blockchains. NASDAQ’s already doing that. We partner with places like Apollo, gigantic asset management firms who are deploying tokenized versions of their private credit fund and other things. Obviously we know um Black Rockck and Bidto which is also an avalanche. So the user the developer is also changing not just the investor. From the investor perspective it’s very interesting. I’m not going to rehash a lot of things but we all know just take Bitcoin as an example. We’ve seen a lot of the what they call the OG have moved their coins in the last 6 months or so. and the incremental buyer of those have frankly been ETFs. Some in part the DATs. Um it’s really a new guard of uh a new type of person looking to get involved in the space from the investor side. There’s two reasons for this. A lot of the OG guys, they were in this for what the space was about. It was a cultural, it’s a community. it would it’s not coincidental that Bitcoin actually took off and was a success after 2008 great financial crisis because people had mistrust in institutions. Now, if that’s what this symbolized for you and was part of the community that you felt proud of to be in and all of a sudden the institutions themselves now are adopting the technology, even if you still love it, it’s just not that sexy for you anymore if you’re that old guard. So, that’s a natural rotation. You know, I liken it to, you know, when I was a young kid, you know, listening to grunge music out of Seattle. But then when Pearl Jam became popular, a lot of my friends who are grunge, you know, enthusiasts suddenly decide they no longer like grunge just because it was getting popular. That’s the same thing somewhat is happening in crypto from the investor side because the adoption is happening. Now the new adopters of this, the new investors, just talk about those not necessarily even the new developers or the new users of it. They are not as call it religious as the OG people were. They have so many choices. They like the thrill. They like to see the high volatility. They are looking at AI stocks, robotic stocks. They’re looking at commodities that recently have gone crazy and they’re competing with prediction markets. So the new investor which is taking up some of the call it supply from the OG um has a lot of choices. So there’s fracturing of that demand as well. So that’s what’s happening in the space. But in general, there’s no doubt you can look at the numbers for stable coins, real world assets being tokenized, the adoption is actually happening. >> So just following up my previous question about whether or not this is a bare market. I think investors want to know if this is still a good time to be in crypto or is it as some people would say debt. There’s so many other spaces to look into in in tech, which we’ll talk about in just a bit. Uh but right now it looks like sentiment is rather lethargic. U institutional investors are leaving the space. I I’ll mention that later. Why should someone look at crypto right now with Bitcoin at $67,000? >> I think this is actually a great time for the discerning investor in crypto or in other parts of technology. This is the I mean there is massive tectonic shifts in different parts of technology and what you’re seeing is individual stock volatility and individual asset volatility call it in crypto happening now. Sure, they may all go down, they may go up, but they’re going up and down completely different um wide bands of how that’s happening. If you are an individual investor and you’re willing to do the homework, especially in crypto and figure out whether it’s Avalanche or other coin that’s actually doing something that’s furthering adoption and furthering utility, then and you can stomach the the volatility. This is an unbelievable time to be an investor. I think this is when the individual who does homework and has conviction will really shine not just in crypto but also in tech as a whole. You’ve seen it with AI. It it used to be three years ago just buy anything named AI or you know or related to AI but now we’ve seen it gone from chips to basically the network players to basically data centers to all of a sudden to now memory and to other parts of it to optical. It’s just a great time to be an investor who actually does their homework. >> Help us make sense of this article then. Um so according to uh a few sources here, there’s been some outflows in Bitcoin ETFs in the month of February. So after four straight days of heavy outflows that wiped out more than $ 1.5 billion. US spot Bitcoin ETFs finally saw a rebound on the 2nd of February. But prior to that, less than a day later on February 3rd, the trend reversed itself again. Bitcoin ETFs recorded $272 million in net outflows. institutions were quick to pull back after the prices failed to move higher. The outflows were led by Fidelity Investments. Um also Arc Invest and uh $90.4 million from Grayscale. Um it looks like some big institutional players are a little bit shaken uh just by looking at the data. Can you help us make sense of this? Why do you think they’re making these kinds of um trades, shall we say? >> Yeah, absolutely. So I mean this is a very specific and short time period. >> Yeah. >> Um I’m talking about the last call it 6 months to a year. >> Sure. >> I mean obviously the last 6 months to a year there’s been massive net inflow into the ETFs. I think in Bitcoin alone there’s still well over a billion dollars of total inflow despite all this recent um exit. And you know the ETF investor a lot of them are really retail and if your average cost is above call it or closer to 100,000 you’re not going to take the pain well and you’re probably going to get out. So yes this is like um an eb in a wave that’s underneath a greater trend that I was talking about earlier. >> The global financial system is rapidly moving on chain and today’s sponsor Cool Wallet is a name worth watching. Cool Wallet builds next generation cold wallets designed for a world where real world assets, payments, and savings live on the blockchain. Their flagship credit card- sized hardware wallets combine CCAL6 plus secure element protection, mobile first usability, and a unique 2 plus one factor authentication system that requires your phone, your biometric ID, and your card to approve every single transaction. So, here’s a cool wallet go card. 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Now, create a new pairing password. This is important for when you need to recover your wallet in case your cards are ever lost. Generate by card. It’s going to ask me to generate a private key. Tap my primary card. Start setup. Now it’s pairing my private key to the primary card. Now that both cards are paired with the private keys and activated, the wallet is ready to go. As you can see, it’s a brand new wallet, so it has no funds in there. Every time you put money in there and you want to transfer funds to another wallet, like this, for example, it will require you to scan and tap the card to the back of your phone. as a security precaution. That’s just one of the benefits of using Cool Wallet. It’s very secure. Remember how I said to remember your uh pairing password? Well, if ever you lose the card, go to settings, go down, replace primary card, and it’s going to ask you to enter your pairing password. That will start the process. So, once you’ve activated the wallet, you can use the app to swap to other tokens and cryptos. All you have to do is first click on the manage icon on the app, add the crypto that you want, then go to the homepage and click on swap, and the crypto you just added should be there. You can also send cryptos to another wallet, making peer-to-peer transactions instantaneous and frictionless. There’s also an earn function that allows you to stake your holdings to generate yield. Cool wallet also recently launched a breakthrough fiat on-ramp feature. So instead of going to a centralized exchange first, you can on-ramp directly to Cool Wallet. Users can create a bank account under their name and a fiat currency of their choosing that’s available, wire the funds in and have those dollars automatically convert it into a stable coin that’s onchain directly into your wallet within minutes. With support for 40 plus mainetss, staking, lending, NFTs, and advanced clear signing protections against fishing and malicious contracts, Cool Wallet is positioning self- custody for mass adoption. To learn more, go to the link down below or scan the QR code here. And if you do use my code, you’ll get a 5% off on your first purchase. I’d also encourage you to check out my interview with Cool Wallet CEO Michael O for more details on the product and why we need self- custody today. And he also explains in great detail how the security functions work. Link also down below. Which comes first now given how much of Bitcoin is owned by institutional investors? Which comes first? Bitcoin going down or up for that matter or institutional selling that’s driving the price down? In other words, has the accumulation of Bitcoin by institutional investors become so large that when they sell, they actually move the market or is it still the other way around? You think? I think it’s getting to more like um 5050. Um it’s not I can’t say the scale has tipped one way or the other. In the past obviously the crypton native was the one that tipped the scales far more over time with institution you know uh institutional call it because or retail within the institutional construct coming into this um made it more balanced. It’s not clear to me yet that it’s so overweight institutional. I know everyone likes to say that, but reality is like raas are just starting to recommend um the crypto ETF um to their investors and that takes 3 to 6 months and they just started it recently. The wirehouses like Morgan Stanley I think last month said they’re going to start allowing their uh wealth advisors to do it and that takes 6 months to 9 months. So from an institutional perspective for the space, I think over time the scale will tip towards them, but right now it’s still pretty balanced. I would say it’s not overly OG and it’s not overly institution. So you’re going to have eb and flow. >> Okay, let’s just take a look at the some macro data. So today uh uh yeah, just today payroll numbers came out. Rose by 130,000 jobs, more than expected. Unemployment went down to 4.3%. So, a very strong jobs report. Uh, stock market a little changed. However, uh, Bitcoin’s down 2%. I wonder why I at least risk assets are not interpreting this as great news. Is it because now the Fed has less of an incentive to cut rates and we might see less liquidity? John, what’s your forecast here? >> I can see on the short-term data having, you know, the employment um, you know, rate coming down to 4.3 means that, you know, and wars being the next, you know, Fed govern the chair um will have less of an incentive and I think if you look at the uh you know the the curve the Fed funds futures is you know people only anticipate two more cuts this year in the back half of the year and this you know short term you know justifies that I guess you know my personal view though is that um you will see more I would take the over in terms of number of rate cuts between now and and the end of the year um I would not just look at one data point if you look that one data point um I think you’re going to miss the greater picture. >> The greater picture I think may be a rotation of interest away from crypto into other tech areas. Correct me if I’m wrong, but that’s maybe how I would interpret the sentiment. >> I talked about that earlier. Yeah, for sure. There’s massive rotation into other not just you know we always talk about the attention economy. You got to find you know the person’s attention. there’s like a attention economy related to investing or speculating or um money you know prediction markets you know betting um sports things as well as like AI as well as robotics all these types of stocks so some of them are justified in terms of valuation others are not it’s what I call vibe investing it seems like >> so how does crypto and I’m grouping Bitcoin in with other altcoins and uh and blockchain tech. How does the industry of crypto stay competitive in an environment where retail and to some extent institutional investors are trading or chasing the tech AI trend and the momentum behind AI and robotics and all the other things? >> That’s a great question. I mean, I liken my my experience when I was investing in um the first wave I would call it, you know, the computing. So, I’ve seen many waves in technology investing. I think people who know me know that I try to identify trends early. Um you know the first was in the 90s and the early 2000s. I call that the computing in the internet age. What we saw there was place play players like Amazon, Google, Netflix. They would disrupt the yellow pages, newspapers and um books borders and and and call it uh Barnes & Noble. And then there was a second wave that was basically the app super wave in the 2010s and SAS and mobile. So in terms of when does it go back? Think about the inter go back to the first wave the internet search era. There were literally 15 different internet search companies including an ask gez that realized search wasn’t good enough so that humans actually answer questions when people typed into the search box. Then you had rationing out and then you had effectively Google and maybe even call number two of Bing and Yahoo stayed around and a few two or three stayed around to be relevant. So what you’re seeing in crypto right now is there are 10,000ish coins on the centralized traded exchanges between Binance and Coinbase and Kraken and other places. you’re getting rationalization and you are going to get ones that are super exciting that are going to outperform. So it’s going to literally uh be to the advantage of the person who does their homework and figures out which ones are attractive as a call it investment if um if they do their homework and that’s what happened with the internet age. you would realize 15 of these were not going to ever be around and if you were able to find the right ones like a Google you would huge winners in the space. Are we seeing a moment when stable coins are becoming a mainstream banking infrastructure? And I bring this up because just now uh I’m seeing news that Fidelity is launching its own stable coin, digital dollar stable coin. Just this past week, Tether launched USAT with Bo Bans, the CEO on January 27th. There’s a lot of new developments in the space. Tell us the future of or about the future of stable coins, John. Yeah, stable coins definitely is product market fit and that’s a product of the crypto ecosystem and it’s come out of that. It definitely is. Just look at the volumes. I mean just you know I would say 18 months ago you had the less than you know a trillion of volume going around primarily no maybe two years ago primarily doing onchain settlement. Now you know by some estimates there’s 10 trillion dollars of stable coins moving around. A lot of that is actually the incremental has come from actually crossber stuff. Um I was just talking to someone who runs a um I don’t want to name any specific companies or names but runs a a big wallet and they also facilitate a lot of movement of stable coins and their customers their partners now are the moneygrams are the western unions and a lot of these uh basically companies that are known for doing crossber stuff. If you look at just the payment section se section of stables that has grown really really fast. Not as big as um the onchain settlement for trading but it is grown really really quick and it’s definitely product market fit. JP Morgancoin is going to have it for settling internal or your own network stuff. It’s going to be a very interesting time. I think the stable coin genius act really unleashed a lot of adoption from traditional enterprises. We saw that at Ava Labs, Ava Lanch in the form of loyalty programs and other um uh partners that we work with uh because suddenly they were comfortable using a stable coin to affect transactions and trades inside of their ecosystem. I think you still need a market clarity, the clarity for the market structure to make it even more adoption oriented, but that’s on the come. Stable coin issuers want to offer yield on their stable coins and this has become the central fight over the clarity act and I’ll just read you a paragraph here. The fight over whether stable coins should be able to offer rewards a lobbying battle between Wall Street bankers and crypto insiders. It’s one of the chief headwinds keeping the Senate Banking Committee from advancing the digital asset market clarity act. Now where do you stand on this debate? Uh John, on the one hand that we want all the positive attributes of banking with an online uh frictionless blockchainbased uh piece of infrastructure known as a stable coin, but we also want interest paid on our savings, right? So I can see why the consumer may want one thing, but banks may not like their their, you know, their their product being challenged. Uh let’s just talk about what you think here. Okay, so this obviously is the big thing right now, especially for um the Clarity Act. In fact, I just had a um breakfast with Brian Style um congressman who um on the house side chair the stable act that helped ultimately uh become part of the genius act for stable coins. Um, listen, I think where I stand and where a lot of people even, you know, if you become just down the fairway fair is you just have to have clear rules for banks as well as for Coinbase and for others. Um, there is a great argument on both sides for why they should be who the system should be the way they want to. You know, we are a fractional reserve system. If all of a sudden everyone can create stable coins, you know, in some sense the Fed and the government lose control of the economy. Um, from a individual perspective, a person in blockchain and crypto, I want to see people able to get stable coin yield. Um, because why, you know, that should be if they can get yield by putting in the bank, but they should be able to get yield and stable coins as well. So, there’s good points on both sides. I think what’s going to happen ultimately based on my conversation around the it was a small clubby round table dinner breakfast actually with with the congressman is that there will be some sort of compromise but getting there is going to be messy and I think this is as messy as it gets before both sides come back to the table. >> Well, you’ve you’ve worked with Wall Street insiders before. Tell us why can’t Wall Street the JP Morgans of the world just issue their own stable coin equivalent and offer yield on that and then everybody will be happy. What’s stopping what’s stopping banks >> they are doing JP Morgan coin yeah settlement purposes for internal or their own private network of transactions so that is already happening in some sense but to create something like this um is a real challenge to things that they’ve done for hundreds of years and the it should be really thought through thoroughly because the first order effects seem likes it, you know, it should be or it should not be so easily, but no one really thinks through the second order and third order effects and you don’t want these unintended consequences. So, I think when you are the incumbent by nature, you don’t want to disrupt yourself. So, I think part of that is that, but also in fairness, I think one one of the things they’re allowing for is to really think through this and what kind of second order and third order effects that can happen because there will be and then you’re going to have issues that people don’t realize. So just maybe help us speculate on what the future may look like maybe in 1015 years if we can put on our futurist hats here now John what will the future of banking look like for the average American >> well we’re already moving towards that for the average American it’s basically the neo bank the uh we started this basically neo bank started in the in the ’90s do boom I remember net bankank was the name of one and it traded like crazy before it got crushed I think you are going to be able to have a choice there will be two types of call it banking, white glove service where there’s more handholding and certain services that you pay a fee for. And then there will be more do-it-yourself. And guess what? The do-it-yourself is going to be very automated, probably less secure and um but more convenient because you don’t have to wait for certain things. So like perfect example would be like um if you think about credit cards right now I actually like my MX even though that’s a high fee for the merchants and the reason is because they have this incredible loyalty program they also have basically they know they’re proactive when someone steals your things or whatever they come and say hey are you in the city and if it’s something that has been done they have insurance and you don’t you’re not responsible for it on the crypto side. I love the fact that I can self-custody things and do things and move stable coins and you know Avalaz has partnered with rank fastest you know growing on for crypto cred you know um and I like that product as well for smaller things. So I have both I like both sides but I can see how certain people want one or the other. So 10 years from now from banking perspective it’s the same thing like every other part of business I’ve seen. You’re going to have high-end service that can only be provided with fees and that life look more traditional, but you’re going to have more DIY, which is more self-custody, self ownership, self moving around and peer-to-peer. >> Well, you obviously saw a future in blockchain, otherwise you wouldn’t have transitioned into the space. Just tell us what this future is that appealed to you the most that enticed your transition from Wall Street into into blockchain. Okay, so it started with frankly in just Bitcoin and first I didn’t get Bitcoin at all. I was trying to look I was a tech investor so everything to me was how big is the TAM, how do I do a DCF and etc etc and try to buy the value of a company. I couldn’t do that. Um and for a couple years I went to these meetups in the early 2010s and I was like wow these guys are just crazy. Um so I definitely even pushed further away from it. It was not until you know call it 2014 and 15 that I reigned my view and perspective on on the space and realized wait this is think of it as more of a commodity like Bitcoin. It’s a finite amount of commodity that’s going to be unearthed, if you will. You can do the math as to how many blocks, how many coins, bitcoins will come out a year, multiply the price. You knew what the incremental supply was. And then we had my team basically counting addresses and making assumption how many dollars per address. And the thing that was clear to me back then was that the adoption was incredible and the incremental demand was 10x that of the incremental supply coming out. And if you think of it that way, this thing was obviously going to go higher. Now, I didn’t get my aha moment in terms of use case and adoption and utility until the ICO boom with Ethereum when you can actually program on a blockchain. when I saw how fast you can do a ICO and crowdfund globally, having been a tech investor and sat on the side of you know the IPOs and road shows um I was fascinated by that and um that’s when I really got into it from a adoption and use case and utility perspective. >> Well, let’s just take something like Avac. If you were to look at Avalanche from an investor’s perspective, not as a founder or president’s perspective, what would it be for you? Would it be a tech play or a monetary debasement play, which is what some Bitcoin speculators or investors think Bitcoin is? >> Avalabs, Avalanche has always been a technology company. From day one, you go back, you know, to the first time we talked in, you know, many of our meetings. Um we’ve always wanted to do two things. One was to create both in the call it sandbox of cryptonative defy etc etc but create real utility real use case. We were the first institutional chain working with you know in 2022 before even FDX we helped KKR tokenize their healthcare growth fund. We’ve always been trying to create technology utility and adoption from day one. So I think going forward you want to as an investor in the space if you want to not not not I’m not giving out any advice. I have to put the disclaimer out there. I’m no longer a hedge fund manager or VC but I’m saying what you should look at is look at chains look at tokens that are actually doing something that are creating real use cases unless it’s Bitcoin which is a you know I would still consider a store of value use case. So look at the ones that have that ability to transition into from crypto asset into enterprise technology and there’s no doubt Avalanche Aval is one of those. >> So linking it back to our earlier conversation about how crypto should stay competitive. How are you making Avalanche competitive in the world of glittery AI uh companies popping up luring capital away from venture capitalists. >> Okay. for see it all starts remember I was a fun I was taught to be a fundamental my various places it all starts with really operating excellence and fundamental development so we’ve worked with great partners and one area that people don’t realize that is that there’s actually a growing loyalty and royalty uh uh adoption on the avalanche blockchain you know I can’t wait for this summer because the FIFA World Cup is going to happen. For instance, FIFA has put their royalty royalty um program on the Avalanche blockchain. We’ve worked with other brands and sports players like Cleveland Cavaliers, the Troy Pistons. What brands have realized now is that the blockchain with the good smart contract is actually a great CRM tool that allows you to directly engage with your customer and that’s led to a lot of incremental revenue. You know, um Cleveland Cavaliers have generated, you know, millions of dollars of revenue because they’re engaging with their fans better. And on the cost side, they don’t have to reacquire or FIFA or other brands don’t have to reacquire their customers through search engine marketing or through feeds on Instagram or Facebook, etc., etc. So, not only they save money from sales and marketing, but they’re also engaging with their fans and giving the fans a better experience and also generating incremental revenue. This is a perfect example of like where stable coins, blockchain being the the the truth source is able to help companies accentuate their businesses. So that’s a perfect example of stuff that I’m very excited about and that you’re seeing that people don’t realize is already happening. >> Um I’ll give you one example than you. So Elon Musk recently announced that Tesla will discontinue the production of Model X and Model S cars uh for Tesla. And so he’s shifting and pivoting into robotics and AI. The Fremont factory that previously produced these cars will now be used instead to to expand the production of Optimus robots. Uh in this pivot towards AI and robotics that not just Tesla is experiencing but I think is a broad industry shift. How are you trying to align with this pivot? >> Yeah. Okay. So first of all just comment on Elon. He’s obviously one of a kind and incredible. Okay. He can he’s he’s one that can actually um sell a dream and get away with it and have a trillion dollar market cap on Tesla. No one else can do that. Other people going back to my earlier statement, you have to actually prove it and with the track record by producing something at least in the long run. Not maybe in the short run you can sell, but at some point you got to sell the numbers. Um Elon can do whatever he wants. So >> how is crypto and how is Avalanche? Well, we are actually, you know, one of the areas that I’m very excited about for all of crypto is once people in crypto developers realize that this is really a horizontal space, not necessarily a vertical space, parts, great features, great things like stable coins or whatever can be used to solve problems in other areas of tech. Then that’s going to lead to people realizing that and I think this is one of the most exciting parts of blockchain and crypto is that besides stable coins blockchain and crypto can actually solve some of the biggest problems that are going to arise from AI. You know, recently we’ve had this fantast bots talking to each other, creating their own bot, Reddit, etc., etc. Like in that world where agents are running rampant, okay, you need a few things. Um, you need one, you need to verify the true source, who’s the, you know, who the provenence of the blockchain can really help with that. you can identify who the real creator is, see the history of it moving from one AI, you know, agent to another. That’s that could be on the blockchain. That truth source is still nothing better underlying data ledger than will be on the blockchain. Also, stable coins, we talked about one day where we’re going to have agents pay for you because you want to go on vacation and somehow your agent just goes and pays for whatever whatever um through someone else’s, you know, agent. That’s only possible if it’s all internet based, digital based and stable coins will do that for you to make that possible. So those are we are talking and working with developers and companies that are still early on that journey but they’re trying to solve those types of problems. >> Yeah. Okay. Perfect. So the future of Avalanche then how will it evolve the use cases and adopt uh adoption? How do you think that’s going to change in the next 10 years? So you’re going to have more so we’re going to right now all of crypto including Avalanche has been very heavy on engineering and less on call it product UI UX and bespoke solutions for certain verticals. So the people in Aval and Avalanche over time are going to be more and more vertical expertise type of people who know specific areas of certain industries. where I talked about loyalty and royalty. Part of the reason why we’re able to get deals there and gaming as well. Part of the reason why we’re able to get deals there is because we hire people from those industries who can get us into the room to discuss the benefits of an Avalanche L1 to help their business. Um, you’re going to see that at Avalanche probably faster than other places. Even the developers that we are hiring, first of all, AI’s already changed our game in terms of development. Um I’ve seen you know our engineering team you know do things twice as fast than they could have done in the past. Now the underlying core product you still need that unbelievable avalanche you know PhD student from Cornell to still work on it but from a testing perspective from a you know aggregating data to do research to to write documentation of how you do APIs and this and that the AI agent has just been tremendous in in helping the engineering team on the marketing side. We used to if we want to create logos for things, we used to outsource things to agencies five, six years ago. We wait weeks for different things to come back and then I would go choose which logo looks good. Today we have like a summer intern who’s in marketing that just instantly creates it and then I I go back and and check it out. So we’ve already adopted from a use internal use perspective. But going forward, we’re also working with other great teams trying to help us create solutions for other industries. >> Perfect. Uh final question. Are we ever going to see us uh well, let’s put it another way. What is the use case for institutional investors to hold cryptos, old coins besides outside of Bitcoin? There are other ETFs for things like Ethereum, Salana. uh why should an institutional investor look into holding one of those for example >> there is an ETF for Avalanche just to be clear >> there’s I think late January and there are other ones on you know on the way I mean basically it goes back to why I said before like which which ones will win um and institutional investors and retail investors need to say which ones are creating real world use and if they do that they should be invested in the case. >> All right, great. John, thanks a lot. And uh where can we follow you and your work and stay up to date with Avalabs? >> Well, thanks. It’s a pleasure to be here. So, avalabs.org if you want to look up the latest that’s happening on Avalabs and Avalanche. And for me, um my Twitter or my ex if you will, John, the number one Wu. >> Okay, we’ll put the links down below. So, make sure to follow John and Ava Labs there. Appreciate it once more, John. We’ll speak again soon. Take care for now. >> Take care. Thank you for watching. Don’t forget to like and subscribe.

Pitch Summary:
Flywire is currently undervalued, trading at approximately 2x sales and 10x 2026 FCF estimates, despite its strong position in niche verticals and significant growth potential. The company is capital light, cash rich, and technologically dominant, with opportunities for growth through cross-selling and new customer acquisition. The market is overly focused on short-term regulatory and political headwinds, particularly in the education sector, but Flywire’s Student Financial Services offering is gaining traction, especially in the UK, which could offset macroeconomic challenges in other regions. A return to 20% growth is possible by 2026, driven by top-line reacceleration and operating leverage. In a bull case scenario, where macroeconomic conditions improve, Flywire could achieve a valuation multiple similar to other technology-led payment companies, offering significant upside potential.

BSD Analysis:
Flywire’s strategic focus on expanding its Student Financial Services (SFS) platform in the UK is a key growth driver, as it encourages international students to pay tuition from their home countries, saving universities significant fees. The company’s recent acquisition of Sertifi, despite initial market skepticism, offers potential revenue synergies, particularly in the travel and hospitality sectors, where Flywire’s payment capabilities complement Sertifi’s contract workflows. Flywire’s emerging profitability, with strong incremental EBITDA margins and robust free cash flow conversion, enhances its attractiveness as an investment. The company’s focus on niche markets with complex cross-border payment needs positions it well for sustained growth, even amidst potential macroeconomic and regulatory challenges. Flywire’s valuation, at 2x sales, suggests the market is underestimating its growth prospects and competitive positioning.

Pitch Summary:
Philips achieved a 19% return for shareholders in 2024, driven by efforts to improve profitability. However, uncertainties in the Chinese market and US litigation related to Respironics products pose challenges. The company’s focus on growth and business simplification aims to enhance margins. Exor’s investment in Philips reflects confidence in its potential, with a 18.4% shareholding. Philips’s strategic initiatives to streamline operations and focus on core competencies are crucial for future growth. The company’s ability to navigate market uncertainties will determine its success in maintaining shareholder value.

BSD Analysis:
Philips’s strategic focus on profitability and growth positions it well to capitalize on opportunities in the health technology sector. The company’s efforts to simplify operations and enhance margins are critical in a competitive market. However, external challenges, such as geopolitical uncertainties and legal issues, could impact its performance. Exor’s significant investment indicates confidence in Philips’s long-term potential, despite current challenges. The company’s ability to innovate and adapt to changing market dynamics will be key to sustaining growth. Investors should monitor Philips’s progress in addressing external challenges and executing its strategic initiatives.

Pitch Summary:
Stellantis faces significant challenges, reflected in a -36% total shareholder return in 2024. The company struggles with fierce competition, regulatory concerns, and operational inefficiencies, particularly in the North American market. The appointment of Antonio Filosa as CEO in June 2025 marks a strategic effort to address these issues. Stellantis trades at a low valuation of 5.69x Price/Cash Flow, indicating market skepticism about its turnaround prospects. Despite being a core holding for Exor, Stellantis contrasts sharply with other high-quality assets in the portfolio. The company’s negative returns on equity further highlight its current struggles.

BSD Analysis:
Stellantis’s current valuation reflects market concerns about its ability to navigate competitive and regulatory challenges. The new leadership under Antonio Filosa brings hope for a strategic turnaround, particularly in underperforming markets like North America. The company’s low valuation presents a potential opportunity if management can successfully implement operational improvements. However, the automotive industry’s shift towards electrification and sustainability poses additional challenges for Stellantis. The company’s historical reliance on traditional automotive markets may hinder its ability to adapt quickly. Investors should closely monitor Stellantis’s strategic initiatives and market responses to gauge future prospects.

Pitch Summary:
Ferrari is a standout luxury brand with a strong growth trajectory, evidenced by a 36% total shareholder return in 2024. The company maintains high margins and a 48% ROE in Q3 2025, showcasing its operational efficiency. Exor, Ferrari’s largest shareholder, has reduced its stake to diversify but remains confident in Ferrari’s growth potential. The company is adeptly balancing its classic gas offerings with new electric models, capitalizing on electrification trends. Ferrari’s ability to maintain high margins as it scales further solidifies its position as a premium investment. The brand’s strong performance and strategic growth initiatives make it a compelling investment opportunity.

BSD Analysis:
Ferrari’s strategic positioning in the luxury automotive market allows it to command premium pricing and maintain robust margins. The company’s focus on electrification aligns with global automotive trends, ensuring its relevance in a rapidly evolving market. Exor’s decision to reduce its stake reflects a strategic diversification rather than a lack of confidence in Ferrari’s prospects. The company’s consistent high ROE and operating margins underscore its operational excellence. Ferrari’s brand strength and innovation in product offerings position it well to capture future growth opportunities. The company’s resilience in maintaining profitability amidst market changes highlights its strong management and strategic foresight.

Pitch Summary:
CalPrivate is a high-performing bank with strong yields on earning assets, robust earnings per share growth, and impressive returns on equity. The bank has demonstrated significant growth in its tangible book value, driven by both loan and deposit expansion. With the opening of a new branch and strategic hires, CalPrivate is poised for continued growth. Trading at 1.27x Price/TBV, the bank is reasonably valued, with potential for upside if it maintains or improves asset quality and efficiency. The bank’s focus on commercial and real estate lending, along with its strong deposit base, positions it well in the current high-interest-rate environment.

BSD Analysis:
CalPrivate’s strategic focus on commercial real estate and business lending, combined with its strong asset quality management, makes it a compelling investment in the regional banking sector. The bank’s ability to recover charged-off loans and maintain a low level of non-performing assets is a testament to its effective risk management practices. Additionally, the bank’s high net interest margin and consistent growth in tangible book value highlight its operational efficiency and profitability. The recent regional banking crisis has shifted deposits from larger banks to smaller institutions like CalPrivate, providing a favorable environment for growth. Furthermore, the Community Reinvestment Act in California supports local banking, enhancing CalPrivate’s ability to attract low-cost deposits and expand its lending activities.

Pitch Summary:
Gossamer Bio’s approach with seralutinib, an inhaled TKI, has shown some promise in a placebo-controlled study with a statistically significant reduction on the PVR biomarker. However, the market found the endpoint underwhelming, and the stock suffered as a result. The trial data indicates a deeper PVR reduction and better 6MWD benefit in more severe WHO Class III patients, but the overall results have been mixed. The imatinib hypothesis, which Gossamer’s strategy is based on, has not been successfully replicated in other forms, raising concerns about the efficacy of seralutinib. The trial’s design and the potential for differentiation with week 48 data are positives, but skepticism remains due to the lack of convincing evidence in milder patient populations.

BSD Analysis:
The imatinib hypothesis has been a challenging one to prove, with many attempts failing to replicate its initial promise. Gossamer Bio’s seralutinib faces similar hurdles, particularly with its efficacy in less severe patient populations. The trial’s reliance on PVR as a biomarker, while standard, has not translated into expected functional benefits, such as 6MWD improvements, which are crucial for market acceptance. The imbalance in WHO Class between trial arms and the historical challenges with imatinib’s safety profile add layers of complexity to the investment thesis. The potential for seralutinib to perform better in more severe patients is intriguing, but the data so far does not convincingly support a broad application. Investors should be cautious and consider the risks associated with the trial’s outcomes and the broader market’s perception of the drug’s efficacy.

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